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The WigWam Power Cable Test

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mosfet
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#1 Posted: Mon Sep 26th, 2005 11:54 pm

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The WigWam Power Cable Test Results

Results hosted below

http://mysite.wanadoo-members.co.uk/hificabletest

Last edited on Thu Oct 6th, 2005 08:23 pm by mosfet

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#2 Posted: Tue Sep 27th, 2005 12:08 am

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voters: 0

Another thing to consider, how much influence on the sound, was 2 chairs a towel and a slighly overweight judge!

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#3 Posted: Tue Sep 27th, 2005 12:21 am

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The results! Excellent.

Two testers recorded felt the standard power cable was better than a £400 Shunyata and only one felt the other way round. Oh dear.

Five tests. Audiophile power leads win three. Standard power lead wins two (and against two of the most expensive!). Essentially random.

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#4 Posted: Tue Sep 27th, 2005 12:29 am

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not conclusive then.. good crack though. Worth a re trial with bigger jury.

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#5 Posted: Tue Sep 27th, 2005 12:31 am

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The fun came after

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#6 Posted: Tue Sep 27th, 2005 12:33 am

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Thanks mosfet - well done.

The point of interest to me is that in every cable test > 2 testers noticed a difference between cables, the same or more than in the control group.
Like you said the numbers of testers are far too small to allow any assumptions but the question of whether cables make a difference (for the better or the worse) seems to be suggestive but certainly not conclusive.

Did one of the testers have a cold

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#7 Posted: Tue Sep 27th, 2005 12:43 am

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Guys,

I'm really sorry that I had to cry off at the last minute. I'm glad that everyone had such a good day. Hopefully, I'll be able to make the next one.

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#8 Posted: Tue Sep 27th, 2005 12:58 am

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Brilliant! Goes to show that the subject of hi-fi is essentially subjective... perhaps the testers were 'positively' looking for differences, hence the poor control result? Also, at the end of the extensive testing session, I'm sure people's ears were tired out.

Would be interesting to see if the dissenting vote consistently came from the same person... :cool:

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#9 Posted: Tue Sep 27th, 2005 01:44 am

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jonjin wrote: Brilliant! Goes to show that the subject of hi-fi is essentially subjective... perhaps the testers were 'positively' looking for differences, hence the poor control result? Also, at the end of the extensive testing session, I'm sure people's ears were tired out.

Would be interesting to see if the dissenting vote consistently came from the same person... :cool:

JJ

People essentially hear what they want to hear a lot of the time. I've had a Yello and I couldnt tell any difference between it and a stock power cord.

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#10 Posted: Tue Sep 27th, 2005 02:25 am

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CJ wrote (on HFC)

Whats your views on the results Mossie?

Random chance if you get a power cord that "works", I mean 2 standard cords that seem to do well against cbales costing 100 times their cost dont you reckon.

My conclusions now added to the above results.

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#11 Posted: Tue Sep 27th, 2005 07:01 am

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tony et al

sounds like you had a good time, did you just change the powerlead on arcam. i wondered if you were tempted to have a go on the BC and seee if that changed things any.

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#12 Posted: Tue Sep 27th, 2005 09:05 am

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I'm saying nothing about the test other than differenices were PLAIN to hear.(Weather you like them is a different matter, the point being differencies were there and on a less than ideal situation too

)
AS far as putting one on the B/C It was already on the enjoying the benefits of proper mains power

The test tried to keep it close to what a lot of forum guys would have, the input mains cables were a £15 13amp B&Q extension and a 6 way surgre protected strip £10.
Other items were listened too after the test.
The B/C can be seriously lifted in performance with the right combination of mains equipment. T.

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#13 Posted: Tue Sep 27th, 2005 10:35 am

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What about you, Earl? You effectievly listened to all of the cables sighted. Did your observations agree with the concensus?

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#14 Posted: Tue Sep 27th, 2005 11:19 am

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That is a wonderful experiment. In fact it is a very brave effort from everyone. After looking at the results I also think we could draw some fairly firm conclusion considering the people involved is trusted by the forum and they are using quality equipments that we all agrees if anything this is the standard that should be revealing enough to show differences in powercords.

Further more you have conducted the experiment with 5 different branded powercords against one standard cords using 3 separate people and included at least one control test as well. That means you have 18 tests in total.

From what I can see when asked could they hear any differences between the powercords they said 15 Yes and 3 No. Unfortunately, the control test demonstrated we cannot reliably conclude they definitely did hear these differences. When asked to compare the same cable twice, majority of 2 to 3 also think they heard differences.

When asked which were better between the standard powercord compared to all the other 5 expensive branded powercords, it appear on 6 times the standard powercords were reported as better against 7 times in favour of the branded versions. Therefore, even if we accept there might be audible differences between these powercords, the listeners also think standard powercord are in fact better about half of the time. This we could conclude also branded versions are not always better.

How come the other people at the event did not participate? It would have given us bigger sample to work with and that would improve the statistical significant.

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#15 Posted: Tue Sep 27th, 2005 11:38 am

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From what I can see when asked could they hear any differences between the powercords they said 15 Yes and 3 No .. the listeners also think standard powercord are in fact better about half of the time

Summary added to test results.

The ‘My conclusions’ part is my conclusion. Thus it includes my opinions, my bias etc.

All else is a factual report of the test results.

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#16 Posted: Tue Sep 27th, 2005 11:40 am

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If you think about it, the idea that it is possible to hear a metre or so of cable providing electricity to a box full of electronic bits and bobs is absurd. But we are quite able to believe absurd things.

Of course, a really good idea for a blind test would be to get someone who says they can hear the difference between two power leads to simply demonstrate it. Should be easy but nobody has ever done this. Why? Because it is almost certainly impossible.

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#17 Posted: Tue Sep 27th, 2005 12:25 pm

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Just to shake things up alittle, later on I deliberately put an ampilifer 'out of phase' to see if any one would notcie the difference.
I'll let the guys explain what happened next...............

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#18 Posted: Tue Sep 27th, 2005 01:04 pm

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In 13 out of 15 instances testers recorded an audible difference. In 2 out of 15 instances testers recorded no audible difference. This should be considered against the result of the control test.
Why? It just showed very clearly the listeners on this occasion always assumed they were differences between the pairs.

Even when the same cable were presented to them they still claimed they heard differences. I can't think of another reason* other then some of them simply think they honestly believe they did. This is a very strange conclusion from you.

*Edited by myself after reading MIB comment in another forum. I really wish this time for once any further discussion that follow are constructive and useful. I hope we learn from this experience and maybe even plan many more improved and better future events. I have for some time considered arranging similar blind comparison. So I would also wish to see how this could be done that is constructive for further debates that include many views from believers or sceptics otherswise there is no point doing.

Last edited on Tue Sep 27th, 2005 02:29 pm by wolfgang

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#19 Posted: Tue Sep 27th, 2005 04:25 pm

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This is a very strange conclusion from you.

Not my conclusion WG; merely a statistical summary of the test results.

My conclusions I’ve tried to clearly differentiate from the reporting of the results with a dotted line.

Why? It just showed very clearly the listeners on this occasion always assumed they were differences between the pairs.

As stated: [the control test] gives a measure of the testers ability to reliably identify an audible difference during A-B testing based on their ability to reliably identify no audible difference where none exists.

The reasons? Most likely those given in the hypothesis - although there are other (much less likely in my opinion) factors that could be considered such as listener fatigue, and unfamiliarity with the test system.

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#20 Posted: Tue Sep 27th, 2005 05:23 pm

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It would be nice to know what these reported differences were,more than "I hear a difference"what difference?how did the sound change,why was one cable better than another,and what was the best cable everyone agree on?

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