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Thread: Bi Wiring

  1. #1
    Founding Member ClassikFan's Avatar
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    I found myself tring to choose the best from a pair of Chord Rumour 2's and a set of Effems chunky copper wires called Lyric.

    My normal setup is with the Rumour (silver plated copper) in single wire run, using Chord Odesey jumpers to connect the twin terminals on my speakers.

    Comparing the Krystal Kables to the Chord, I found more bass wiith the Krystal Cable but a duller top end, as opposed to a brighter top with less bass detail anddepth with the Chord.

    The next test was to biwire using theRumour for the tweeter and the Krystal Lyric for the bass. Low and behold I now have the best of both worlds, and I am sure having two types of wire makes a difference opve just straight biwiring using the same cable for both high and low frequencies.
    Just coz you got the power... that don't mean you got the right.

  2. #2
    Super Dooper Wammer rockmeister's Avatar
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    Post imported post

    Yes old chap. I remember concluding something very like that on a thread not far away not long ago. I have always found that Silver cables work best at the top end and copper for the bottom (as it were). If a speaker is designed to be bi wired (and learned friends have pointed out that some are not, and therefore seem to sound best with single wire and jumper then in (my) theory each drive unit can be tuned to sound how you wish with different cables. These dont have to be expensive by the way. Some of the best copper cable I have used was heavy duty mains cable... only a few pence per meter, with more exotic silver stuff for the tweeter.
    Anyway, what can be lost by experimenting with this?? If it don't work, don't keep it. Maybe a good forum like this could start a 'HiFi exchange' area, where cheapish bits of kit like cables, plugs etc could be swapped by interested parties? All it would cost would be the postage. What about it No.6.??
    still just watching clouds

  3. #3
    Founding Wammer Kiang's Avatar
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    Post imported post

    Check the LCR theory on this thread.

    http://www.hifiwigwam.com/forum1/335-3.html

  4. #4
    Wammer mosfet's Avatar
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    Post imported post

    If Chord Rumour is your preferred choice of ‘speaker cable CF then you could save yourself some money with the following:

    PTFE wire 19/0.2mm Type A 01-3030 £12.20 25m reel

    http://www.rapidelectronics.co.uk/rk...&XPAGENO=1

    This equipment wire has the same specification as the Rumour (19/0.2 silver plated copper / PTFE) but works out at approx £1 per stereo metre as opposed to approx £10 per stereo metre for the Rumour.

    What’s the difference between the two?

    A silicon sheath, some advertising in WHF? and about nine quid! ;)




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    An awful lot of so called 'Top makes' are one and the same cable, made in a factory in Taiwain 'Wang Lung' their own brand is Neotech cables, Acoustic Zen, Harmonic Tech,Vampire wire,(their are at least 6 more top brands I feel made here) maybe some chord (not sure on that one), Furutech, I believe the presendient of Harmonic half owns the plant (Jim Wang). Townsehend is Gote MI2 just dipped in the freeze tank by Frozen solid. I will point out there are few genuine hand build cables manufactures in thois country at least 6 makers I believe.
    Those that built from scrtach and not off the rool and just use a fancy covering.
    weather the indivdual likes what they do is a different matter. Mr.C
    Distributor/stockists of Audio Physics/Art Loudspeakers/Belles /Bel canto/Black Ravioli/Coherent-Systems cabling /Esoteric/Focal Loudspeakers/Heco loudspeakers/Puresound/Revolver Loudspeakers/RPG Panels/Still points/Townshend audio

  6. #6
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    Bi-wiring, I'm not conviced at all, if you have 2 runs of cables, try using one pair of cables as very long jumpers, can you hear a difference?

    Distributor/stockists of Audio Physics/Art Loudspeakers/Belles /Bel canto/Black Ravioli/Coherent-Systems cabling /Esoteric/Focal Loudspeakers/Heco loudspeakers/Puresound/Revolver Loudspeakers/RPG Panels/Still points/Townshend audio

  7. #7
    Founding Member ClassikFan's Avatar
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    Post imported post

    The point here is that I can hear a difference between using the Krystal Kable and the Chord. Combining the 2 gives me the best attributes of both.
    Just coz you got the power... that don't mean you got the right.

  8. #8
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    Post imported post

    Classic, I didn't say you couldn't here a difference, If you usding the same cables for both bi-wire/jumpers, then that may give a difference result.
    Isn;t Frank speaker cable all silver, much like Front floaters?
    Distributor/stockists of Audio Physics/Art Loudspeakers/Belles /Bel canto/Black Ravioli/Coherent-Systems cabling /Esoteric/Focal Loudspeakers/Heco loudspeakers/Puresound/Revolver Loudspeakers/RPG Panels/Still points/Townshend audio

  9. #9
    Admin hifiwigwam's Avatar
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    Post imported post

    Mr Coherent wrote:
    Classic, I didn't say you couldn't here a difference, If you usding the same cables for both bi-wire/jumpers, then that may give a difference result.
    Isn;t Frank speaker cable all silver, much like Front floaters?
    The Lyrics are copper Tony. I have some on the go as we speak. Not bad at all. The Silver ones Frank has are the same as Front Floaters and did marvelous things to my HiFi. If i had the budget I would have kept them here.

  10. #10
    Wammer
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    Thanks James, the silver ones I know well
    Best i not bring any of mine round I feel.
    Distributor/stockists of Audio Physics/Art Loudspeakers/Belles /Bel canto/Black Ravioli/Coherent-Systems cabling /Esoteric/Focal Loudspeakers/Heco loudspeakers/Puresound/Revolver Loudspeakers/RPG Panels/Still points/Townshend audio

  11. #11
    Admin hifiwigwam's Avatar
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    Post imported post

    Mr Coherent wrote:
    Thanks James, the silver ones I know well
    Best i not bring any of mine round I feel.

    noooooo




  12. #12
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    Post imported post

    Kiang...went back and read your thread link and particularly your comments about low inductance for high frequencies and low resistance for low frequencies. Put into simple terms please, which conductor materials suggest themselves? Do my intuitive reactions (silver for high / copper for low) match your laws? If not, please explain it to me in simple terms, since I fancy making some runs up to try. (Keep it real simple old chap... I'm an Artist and recognise colours, thicknesses and bendiness only!) .
    Then if this works out, and Mosfets cheap cable source, or my idea of mains cable is ok, maybe we can all be smiling and richer by Christmas!
    still just watching clouds

  13. #13
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    I can see the logic behind your thought but alas it is not as straight forward as that - electrically anyway.
    As for those descriptions that copper cables sound "coppery" and silver cables"silvery" - this may indeed be true or false - I simply don't know.

    Try this:
    two twisted pairs of mosfets silver plated copper cable (twisted again but carefully seperated at ends and checked with multimeter) for the high end. Keep twists about 2 cm intervals.
    Use 2.5 mm van damme speaker cable from maplins , use two runs (a pair in each run leave outer blue sheath intact), connect both reds to red terminal and so on - use this for your low end.Twist this pair about every 4-6 inches
    This design keeps the capacitance reasonably low as to be safe for most amplifiers.

    The above does not take into account the high capacitance theory which is a different kettle of fish altogether nor does it completely address the effect of inductance - both of which are technical and quite tedious

    As regards connectors ,soldering etc - I 'm sure you know this.
    Try this and swop high for low after a good listening session.
    Remember the basics- well worth it to repeat here , i.e phase , check with multimeter etc

    Let us know how you get on.
    I have designed several prototypes so far and although I agree that cables in the market today are indeed high priced , it is not possible to design one that is really cheap either which achieves or meets my requirements.
    The idea that there is a really cheap solution to this that we are all missing ever appears distant to me.


  14. #14
    Wammer mosfet's Avatar
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    For a nice uniform twist cut two lengths of cable and tie the ends to a hook in a wall or door handle. Pull the opposite ends as tightly as possible and clamp in the chuck of a power drill. Give a couple of short bursts on the power drill while pulling tightly on the cable.

    The silver plated PTFE equipment wire mentioned is also available from RS (or something very similar) and the subject of this thread.

    http://zerogain.com/forum/showthread.php?t=8302




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