CD mastering

[tuga]

This is a 1967 analog recording by Supraphon, the Scherzo of Bruckner's 7th by Matacic and Česká.

The first graph shows Supraphon's re-mastering for a 2004 CD edition while the second one was made in Japan by Mastersonic (Denon):

[Boxer]

So the top one is actually hitting the peak limiter?

[tuga]

Yes, and the Mastersonic exhibits wider "micro-dynamics" (if we can called it that) in constant SPL moments, f.ex. between minutes 7 and 8.

[tuga]

Peter's 1812; audiophiles' much loved sound of...clipping cannon shots?


Philips/Mercury 1995 (ADD)

[Butuz]

I love your graphs.

I love your posts with graphs in. So enlightening.

Butuz

[Butuz]

Can you measure anything by Foo Fighters? I have a feeling your graphs would show mostly clipping in some of their tracks.

Butuz

[Epiphany Acoustics]

Really interesting graphs.. It would be interesting to see such graphs for a whole range of music... Modern, old, metal, 'radio 1 songs'...

[karlinamillion]

This is a 1967 analog recording by Supraphon, the Scherzo of Bruckner's 7th by Matacic and Česká.

The first graph shows Supraphon's re-mastering for a 2004 CD edition while the second one was made in Japan by Mastersonic (Denon):

It seems to me that the master tape was played on different machine.
The differences are interesting though.
The second machine seems to have a slightly greater dynamic range (not slew rate), or maybe someone's been riding the fader, either squeezing the DR in the first graph, or opening it in the 2nd.
Have a look at the peak at about 3'52 and the peak at about 4'20", in the upper graph the difference is about 8dB, in the lower abot 10dB.
Also the peak at 2'40" seems very different between the two.
As for 'micro dynamics', there certainly seems to be something going on between 1'00" & 1'20", and also 7'00" & 7'30"
Maybe the most telling bit is at the very end when it drops to silence, about -66dB on the top graph, below -69dB on the lower.


Of course some one may have done a little processing, who knows?

Do you know what source was used for each graph?

[AmDismal]

The peak at 30" appears clipped on the top one even though it doesn't reach 0dB. Clearly just terribly mastering, just to get a couple of dB more. I can understand dynamic compression on pop (although it is loathsome!), but this is just shoddy.

[tuga]

Can you measure anything by Foo Fighters? I have a feeling your graphs would show mostly clipping in some of their tracks.

Butuz

Sorry, I don't have any of their albums...

[tuga]

4. Weird Fishes



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1. Leaving New York 2004



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4. Brompton Oratory 1997



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6. The Boxer 2001 remastered



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6. This Side Of The Blue 2004



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1. Night Train 1997 remastered



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Kind of Blue 1986 (wrong speed)




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Kind of Blue 1997 - audiophile "tube" remaster

[SteveS1]

Can you measure anything by Foo Fighters? I have a feeling your graphs would show mostly clipping in some of their tracks.

Butuz

Get on to the Steve Hoffman forum, more wave forms and graphs than you could shake a stick at.

Foo Fighters, Killers etc. Very fertile ground for a waveform that looks like a solid block. Glad I'm not that keen on their stuff tbh, the latest Adele album that everyone is raving over has been largely trashed by Sterling Sound too. All very depressing.

[adamdea]

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Kind of Blue 1997 - audiophile "tube" remaster

That is absolutely shocking- hang on is that the version I have (don't remember tubes coming into it)

[tuga]

Don't worry, tubes clip softly...

[tuga]

Bought myself a cheap used early edition CD of "Time Out" hoping that it wouldn't sound as bright'n'splashy as the current Sony/Columbia version and the tonal balance is very very different indeed, sounding much closer to what you would expect from a recording of the late 50s and to vinyl without the exagerated treble of most current jazz CDs.



But unfortunately, and despite never peaking above -3dB, there's a lot of clipping similar to the "Kind of Blue" 1997 measurement.

Cheers,
Ric

[florette69]

Bought myself a cheap used early edition CD of "Time Out" hoping that it wouldn't sound as bright'n'splashy as the current Sony/Columbia version and the tonal balance is very very different indeed, sounding much closer to what you would expect from a recording of the late 50s and to vinyl without the exagerated treble of most current jazz CDs.



But unfortunately, and despite never peaking above -3dB, there's a lot of clipping similar to the "Kind of Blue" 1997 measurement.

Cheers,
Ric

Worth comparing that with the Sony HDCD which I believe was tube mastered. To my ears, most of those early CBS Masterpieces CDs sound really terrible! Less than wonderful tape sources, poor eq choices.

[murray johnson]

You should look at some of the RvG re-mastered Blue Note recordings on CD. Bloody awful they are. Great music but a million miles from the analogue originals.

[montesquieu]

This is VERY depressing. Is it just incompetence or are they trying to achieve something by this?

[florette69]

You should look at some of the RvG re-mastered Blue Note recordings on CD. Bloody awful they are. Great music but a million miles from the analogue originals.

You don't need to be familiar with the old records; even objectively, many of those RVG remasters are simply unpleasant listening experiences. Aural vandalism.

[NAM]

4. Weird Fishes



___



1. Leaving New York 2004



___



4. Brompton Oratory 1997



___



6. The Boxer 2001 remastered



___



6. This Side Of The Blue 2004



___



1. Night Train 1997 remastered



___



Kind of Blue 1986 (wrong speed)




__




Kind of Blue 1997 - audiophile "tube" remaster

I have that nighttrain version....it's one of my "system at it's best" cd's so encouraging to see the trace!