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  1. #1821
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    Hi Earl! Thank you very much for your input - I appreciate it a lot!

    Good to hear that you consider it to be serviceable in the future.

    So I guess I will start to tinker with the other components as you have recommended.

    I will start with the pre-amp and cd player as I am anyway thinking of something like a pre-amp + dac - audiolab m-dac comes to my mind as I have a Cyrus CD 8x and an Arcam Alpha 7 se as a transport anyay plus it will provide me the possibility to use my laptop and other stuff in the future more flexible.

    Next, I will be looking for smooth loudspeakers - bringing me back to SSM and this thread.

    So, thanks a lot from Austria!

    PS: Nevertheless, I am still interested to hear the opinion about the QUAD 909.
    Last edited by ewe_gb; 25-07-2012 at 01:33 AM.

  2. #1822
    Super Wammer myrman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ewe_gb View Post
    Hi Earl! Thank you very much for your input - I appreciate it a lot!

    Good to hear that you consider it to be serviceable in the future.

    So I guess I will start to tinker with the other components as you have recommended.

    I will start with the pre-amp and cd player as I am anyway thinking of something like a pre-amp + dac - audiolab m-dac comes to my mind as I have a Cyrus CD 8x and an Arcam Alpha 7 se as a transport anyay plus it will provide me the possibility to use my laptop and other stuff in the future more flexible.
    ewe_gb Buy this

    http://www.hifiwigwam.com/showthread...-Headphone-amp

    Great bit of kit.

  3. #1823
    Founding Wammer SSM's Avatar
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    Earl of Doublechinburied has spurted advice the cream of which is worth savouring. Don't be too quick to replace a major component in your system. Sometimes a little judicious tweaking can effect improvements.

    I'd echo the warning about MF gear. Partnered wrongly, it can produce overpowering treble. The M1 DAC and my assorted MF amps were a mismatch with the most resolving speaker in my harem - the ELAC. iirc, there's a member about here who uses the same MF A1 FBP preamp as yours, but into the 909. Wickedman68, or somewhat. Maybe you could get his feedback on this combo.

    As for the 909 sonics, this star Quad is certainly one very smooth operator. Unlike my manic curry-stirring wammate, I don't find it 'dull' at all. Certainly not with ELAC or ATC standmounts, both of which are armed with dynamic smack and chiselled treble.

    You complain of forwardness in your current setup. Well, while the 909 is smooth, its not laidback though. Turn up the wick and it will literally huff and puff the sound into your face. I tried it with my Xeros, the standmount sibling of your Xones, and feared for the health of its little plastic cone. The midrange heft from the 909 threatened to warp it during higher levels! IMO the Xero seems built for delicate music-making with entry-level Leema amplification (which is lithe and supple IME). The 909 might prove too brutish and full-on for your Xones, which double up on the Xero's little cones.

    If it were me, I'd go for the nice Arcam A38 instead to pair the Xones. Or if the Avondale is staying, just change the MF cdp for a Rega or Arcam (neither produces brightly-lit cdps). I had replaced my M1 DAC with the Rega DAC. In a nutshell, the change was a fuller sound, with well-balanced treble and a soundstage that is set deeper than the MF's forwardness.

    Also heard Arcam's CD17, reckon its better balanced than MF's current cdps and could be a cost-effective remedy for your situation.

    SS
    Last edited by SSM; 25-07-2012 at 10:43 AM.
    CONRAD-JOHNSON HD3 & ET3SE > SUN SV-2A3 L.E. 25th Anniv. SE Class A | NAIM DAC V1 > C-J CLASSIC 60SE PP
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    SS relics: REGA ELICIT, ARCAM A38, Musical Fidelity X-A2, NAIM NAP 100, QUAD 909, SONY TA-F246E | MiniWatt N3

  4. #1824
    Founding Wammer SSM's Avatar
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    Yes. Wednesdays are my only off days this year. They are the only chance I get to have the main rig powered on all day and post a little on the Wam.


    Well, the system has been playing tunes for over 12 hours now and well-soaked in leccy. I must declare this now because I fear I might not get to say it in case I unexpectedly get killed by a bus, a bolt of lightning or a dodgy pizza.


    I have used close to 40 items in this audio hobby. Those that have left solidschateau were sold because they had ceased to captivate me sonically. (None have died on me because I never used them that long, young box-swapper I was).


    Of this pile of audio boxes, the one item that I cherish the most, my #1 beloved is:-




    ^ my Rega Elicit!!! a.k.a. 'Dana' (2000db)


    I usually get slowly disenchanted with any piece I have over time. This Elicit is the only one to buck my fickleness. My luv for it grows with every passing month of ownership, that it's starting to scare me.

    Ten thrilling months with me now.

    I have read practically every pro review of the Elicit on the interwebs now. A couple are spot-on (Tone Audio and The Absolute Sound). Those are full articles. The best summary of the Elicit, that totally agrees with my own experience, comes from a uk dealer's Elicit page (Signals).

    "Scale, vibrancy and dynamics came with a level of detail retrieval that was just a tad unnerving." YES

    "There was some lovely stuff going on in the percussion that was up there with the best of them. The musicality (top to bottom), the scale. . . the works. No more 'tizz' and a lot more colour. Absolutely stunning."
    YES


    "utterly spell-binding at low levels"
    YES YES YES


    The Elicit and ELAC ran through a purple patch this evening while playing a french-based bossa-jazz radio station. For one hour the reproduction of the lively percussion over 15+ songs just hit me between the eyes. Perfect intonation of the deepest low notes, replete with so much subtle detail, dynamics and rhythmic flair. The final two tracks Nicola Conte's Bossa Per Due and Pizzicato Five's Porno 3003 with busy bustling drums that drove deep, swept me away.


    I might have this Elicit buried with me when my time's up.



    Wammates will know my activity on here has petered out significantly over the past months. I'm always reading but it's been a struggle to get any post finished because my attention gets pulled away by the Rega. (this msg was started three hours ago)

    Reckon I could live with this amp forever. I've perused two integrateds in a higher price bracket this year - the MF M6i and Primare I32. The former couldn't outshine the Elicit and it looks like I'm done with being a MF fanboy. The verdict's still pending on the handsome inky black Primare.

    I'm starting to think/fear a true leap in quality over the Elicit is going to come from another Rega:




    ^ a god amongst amps - the Osiris.

    Heavy price tag to match the heavy build, gulp. Going to have to sell many tonnes of flowers to get it.

    No chance to demo it in Tipoca. No real demand for it in this economic cline, no showroom model, gonna have to indent if I really want it. I'll see how my petty cash sizes up over the year.


    Any wammer heard or own one?


    SS
    CONRAD-JOHNSON HD3 & ET3SE > SUN SV-2A3 L.E. 25th Anniv. SE Class A | NAIM DAC V1 > C-J CLASSIC 60SE PP
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    SS relics: REGA ELICIT, ARCAM A38, Musical Fidelity X-A2, NAIM NAP 100, QUAD 909, SONY TA-F246E | MiniWatt N3

  5. #1825
    Founding Wammer s2000db's Avatar
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    Awww bless ......

  6. #1826
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    Hi Solid State! Just wanted to thank you for your input.

    Just try again my old MF X-A 200 R, it needs some renovation, together with my Arcam Alpha 7 SE cd player. Not that bad actually. I could live again with it for some time to come - hopefully the amp doesn't break down completely.

    But I still can see that the MF X-A 200 R is on the bright side and seems I have that earlier not so sure about now....

    Anyway I think, I will join the integrated-camp again.

    Thinking of your much cherished Rega Elicit or Arcam A 38 or maybe a QUAD 77 integrated amp.

    Then add a decent dac, Arcam, Rega or Audiolab. Arcam or Cyrus cd player remaining as a transport.

    And finally maybe change the speakers.

    If speakers are to stay, then I think the partnership with the Arcam could be rewarding.

    Still I have some standmount-speakers - the AURA with the lineaum tweeters - if you ever heard of those tweeters....

  7. #1827
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    double post
    Last edited by ewe_gb; 25-07-2012 at 04:54 PM.

  8. #1828
    Founding Wammer SSM's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by earlofsodbury View Post
    That Elicit is a very handsome thing I must admit, but never heard either that or the Osiris.

    I'd never buy anything so expensive unheard - it's a BIG financial hit to take if you don't like it. Better to invest in the airfare to get somewhere you can hear one.
    Yeah. I might have to fly over to Blighty for the demo and bunk down with a London wammer.
    (ps: for those willing to put me up, this metrosexual doesn't sleep on bedsheets whose thread count is less than 200, be warned!)

    I do find the Elicit sleeker and handsomer than the Osiris, whose volume knob reminds me of a dial on a microwave oven I once had. Still, if the sound quality is stupendous, the Osiris' behemoth styling will not matter.

    But it is a lot of money. And what if it sounds like the Elicit at normal listening levels. Those wammers who nag that all amps sound the same when driving at levels below clipping, will have a field day. (Tones) (ncdrawl) (mosfet)

    And I could buy a lot of cakes with the money saved.()

    cheerSS
    CONRAD-JOHNSON HD3 & ET3SE > SUN SV-2A3 L.E. 25th Anniv. SE Class A | NAIM DAC V1 > C-J CLASSIC 60SE PP
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    SS relics: REGA ELICIT, ARCAM A38, Musical Fidelity X-A2, NAIM NAP 100, QUAD 909, SONY TA-F246E | MiniWatt N3

  9. #1829
    Founding Wammer SSM's Avatar
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    Ewe, re: Elicit and Xones

    I heard the Xones when I bought my Xeros and demo'd the Pulse/Stream combo. Its a compact floorstander. A bigger sound than the Xero but comparatively less endowed in the bass than price rivals. I don't reckon it's the right speaker that will allow the Elicit to strut its prowess at deep bass lines. For my money, I'd like to try the Arcam A38 with the Xones.

    Not heard the Aura. The only standmount on my mind is Dynaudio Focus 160 and I'm just about settled on it as the pressie to give my Elicit on its one-year anniversary in Sep (which marks Dana's 55th birthday). And name it Dyna-Dana. Or if temptation wrecks me, I'll have it in August, name it after Stratie and enjoy many evenings listening to 'Dana' pump its juice into 'Lindsay'.

    SS
    CONRAD-JOHNSON HD3 & ET3SE > SUN SV-2A3 L.E. 25th Anniv. SE Class A | NAIM DAC V1 > C-J CLASSIC 60SE PP
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    SS relics: REGA ELICIT, ARCAM A38, Musical Fidelity X-A2, NAIM NAP 100, QUAD 909, SONY TA-F246E | MiniWatt N3

  10. #1830
    Super Wammer dudywoxer's Avatar
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    I have, as you would expect heard the isis/osiris. I only have one problem with either part of the pairing, and that is nothing to do with sound quality, or even sound per pound, its simply that I'm too much of a pauper to be able to afford them.
    Music is a colourfull outburst of the soul, Can I use the colours I choose, Do I have some say what you use, Can I get some greens with my blues?

  11. #1831
    Founding Wammer SSM's Avatar
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    Dudy, you just confirmed my worst fears. Isis and Osiris produce stunning sound (pls just don't tell me how good)
    I'm a struggling florist and unless I land a sales coup, I join you in your unrequited love for these ultimate Regas.

    Darn, what are the chances of finding a mint Osiris on eBay going for 10% of its rrp? Like the usual Musical Fidelity cast-offs...

    Zilch.

    SS
    CONRAD-JOHNSON HD3 & ET3SE > SUN SV-2A3 L.E. 25th Anniv. SE Class A | NAIM DAC V1 > C-J CLASSIC 60SE PP
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    SS relics: REGA ELICIT, ARCAM A38, Musical Fidelity X-A2, NAIM NAP 100, QUAD 909, SONY TA-F246E | MiniWatt N3

  12. #1832
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    Good memory...I had the FBP and 909 driving a pair of Harbeths and loved them, the MF made the 909 sound more exciting then previous pre's but not harsh at all, the only issue i would say is it loses compsore at loud (very loud) levels, my prevous 50w hybrid was much better with the volume up. I have a feeling I will own the MF/Quad combo again one day


    Quote Originally Posted by SSM View Post
    Earl of Doublechinburied has spurted advice the cream of which is worth savouring. Don't be too quick to replace a major component in your system. Sometimes a little judicious tweaking can effect improvements.

    I'd echo the warning about MF gear. Partnered wrongly, it can produce overpowering treble. The M1 DAC and my assorted MF amps were a mismatch with the most resolving speaker in my harem - the ELAC. iirc, there's a member about here who uses the same MF A1 FBP preamp as yours, but into the 909. Wickedman68, or somewhat. Maybe you could get his feedback on this combo.

    As for the 909 sonics, this star Quad is certainly one very smooth operator. Unlike my manic curry-stirring wammate, I don't find it 'dull' at all. Certainly not with ELAC or ATC standmounts, both of which are armed with dynamic smack and chiselled treble.

    You complain of forwardness in your current setup. Well, while the 909 is smooth, its not laidback though. Turn up the wick and it will literally huff and puff the sound into your face. I tried it with my Xeros, the standmount sibling of your Xones, and feared for the health of its little plastic cone. The midrange heft from the 909 threatened to warp it during higher levels! IMO the Xero seems built for delicate music-making with entry-level Leema amplification (which is lithe and supple IME). The 909 might prove too brutish and full-on for your Xones, which double up on the Xero's little cones.

    If it were me, I'd go for the nice Arcam A38 instead to pair the Xones. Or if the Avondale is staying, just change the MF cdp for a Rega or Arcam (neither produces brightly-lit cdps). I had replaced my M1 DAC with the Rega DAC. In a nutshell, the change was a fuller sound, with well-balanced treble and a soundstage that is set deeper than the MF's forwardness.

    Also heard Arcam's CD17, reckon its better balanced than MF's current cdps and could be a cost-effective remedy for your situation.

    SS

  13. #1833
    Founding Wammer SSM's Avatar
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    Don't hear the QSP too soon then, Scott. You may not be able to resist it.

    ...

    I'd thought I had closed my account with KEF for good. The best-selling Coda 7 was fun during my student days and the entry-level Qcompact was quite serviceable as a stopgap during the time when I was disenchanted with this hifi hobby. Although it left me with the impression that the KEF sound is hard and tinny.

    Then KEF came back to my attention when fellow Arcam A28 owner Nick1881 raved about the new R300 he got to pair the A28, about how smooth it was and how it bettered the doubly-priced alternatives he demoed. KEF? Smooth and powerful?

    His comment had me inclined to drop by the KEF dealer when chance availed. And it did last week. I wandered in... and almost dropped my bag of donuts to hold my hands to my mouth and go squeeeee!!! when I saw them.


    Not the ok-looking R300.





    This!




    ^ handsomest metrosexiest standmounts that look even better in the flesh. Did the designer of Nespresso's delicious Decaffeinato Lungo capsule also chose the colour of the KEF's uniQ driver? They are the same colour.


    The demo was someone else's. Oooh...!!! This LS50 commemorates KEF's 50th year and also celebrates its heritage of being one of the supplier of the drive units for Beeb's iconic LS3/5a. It is supposed to perform like a modern LS3/5a, but compared to the Harbeth P3ESR and Spendor SA1 I lusted after in 2010, I don't see this LS50 as a LS3/5a clone. I hear it as a killer of such clones. The sound coming forth has studio monitoring cred just like the Spen/Har but where dynamics and bass reach are concerned, it makes the SA1 and P3ESR look like the overpriced thin-walled white elephants they now are. IMO. The sound is wide wide open with authority in the bass that eludes the SA1 and P3ESR. It's big, smooth and rich yet detailed. And so out of the box. I got hold of the HFN review now and the lab test shows it dives to 42dB!, compared to the 70Hz and 80Hz limits for the Pee and SA1 (Stereophile). A super LS3/5a with low-hanging bollocks.

    B&W PM1 is more than doubly-priced but it isn't as smooth and coherent as the LS50 throughout the frenquency range. That disconnected front ported bass is to blame. I already luv this LS50 more. The PM1 may have the more finessed treble though. I heard traces of metallic ping coming from the LS50 but nothing that sticks out jarringly. If time avails I'm going to bring my own music for the demo next week to put the LS50's tweeter through the paces. If all goes well, a pair could come to solidschateau in time for Stratie's birthday and christened KEF LindSayis50+. Can't believe it only costs 850!




    ^ this clip from Munich gives a good glimpse of the LS50's clean crisp sonics. At 1:14 that's Paul Messenger looking behind the billboard for a hidden subwoofer.

    Also read elsewhere that John Dawson bought a pair. Yes, I do reckon the LS50 will sound marvellous allied to the clean neutrality of the A38/A28.

    SS
    Last edited by SSM; 01-08-2012 at 10:50 AM.
    CONRAD-JOHNSON HD3 & ET3SE > SUN SV-2A3 L.E. 25th Anniv. SE Class A | NAIM DAC V1 > C-J CLASSIC 60SE PP
    PRIMARE DAC30 > AYRE K-5xeMP > 6V6GT SE Class A | audiolab M-DAC
    > ICON AUDIO LA4 MKIII > EL84 SE Class A
    MUSICAL FIDELITY X-T100
    (modded valve pre) > GENESIS Advanced Tech. M60 (& I60) PP | PRIMARE A34.2 Class D
    OMEGA SUPER ALNICO & 3i Monitors |
    PRECISION 6.2, ELAC BS244, ATC SCM11, S3/5R, Alnico, XERO, DM 2/6, Q 2020i
    SS relics: REGA ELICIT, ARCAM A38, Musical Fidelity X-A2, NAIM NAP 100, QUAD 909, SONY TA-F246E | MiniWatt N3

  14. #1834
    Αdministrator notaclue's Avatar
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    Can I be the first to say that they will double as a handle orange squeezer. Ideal for when you want a freshly squeezed glass of orange juice.

  15. #1835
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    Gorgeous, aren't they, Paul? This is one of the most unboxy sounding standmounts I've ever heard. That curved and extensively-braced front baffle really cut out any sonic intrusions from the cabinet. And any port chuffing is near inaudible. The KEF people put in an ovoid, flared port that has soft padding in the middle passage. Slot your hand into it and it's like putting your hand into a c.... (not that I approve of such unmetrosexual acts ) but Penance and you would love the tactile sensation of the LS50's ports.

    Just don't let your g/f catch you 'hand-cleaning' the LS50's ports, if you do buy a pair.

    SS
    Last edited by SSM; 01-08-2012 at 11:10 AM.
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  16. #1836
    Founding Wammer SSM's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by notaclue View Post
    Can I be the first to say that they will double as a handle orange squeezer. Ideal for when you want a freshly squeezed glass of orange juice.
    You don't want any insipid tangy citrus to sip when you listen to the LS50.
    You want a powerful smooth Nespresso to compliment the LS50's rich sonics.Mmm, with the 1k+ saved buying a LS50 than the PM1 (the KEF is really better, methinks) I can have Leema Elements DAC to play with sooner.


    SS
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  17. #1837
    Super Wammer
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    I'm very close to pulling the trigger on a pair of those. Been speaking to a dealer about them and he reckons they challenge speakers at more than twice the price. I have read they dip down to 3.2ohm though, so am a tad concerned about what will be needed to drive them. What was being used in the demo you stumbled on ssm?

  18. #1838
    Moderator HoopsOnToast's Avatar
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    My old dealer says they would be right up my street, A visit to Coventry is in order I think....
    I dont like the look of them though TBH, but thats never stopped me buying anything before.

    Be interesting to see how they compare to my LS3/5A competitors, the Kolts and my current 'new monitor' fav, the SCM7
    Last edited by HoopsOnToast; 01-08-2012 at 12:09 PM.
    TBC / SME M2-9 / AT33PTG / Trichord Dino - Yamaha DVD-S1700 - Benchmark DAC1 HDR - DIY 2-Way Actives
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  19. #1839
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    Top of range AV gear in 2-ch mode.

    KEF spec'd the LS50 as 3.2 ohm minimum but the HFN review found that 3.8ohm is the lowest as the LS50 will dip. Phase angles are a bit wild though, so a well-sorted integrated in the 1.5 -2.5k class might be the better match.

    As for sound per pound, yes I personally do reckon this LS50 belongs to the same price pantheon as B&W PM1 and ProAC D2 but KEF seems to have left out an extra 1k in the pricing. As of now, I'm undecided between this LS50 and Dynaudio Focus 160 for myself. I'll just need my own demo to ascertain if the pedigree of the the LS50's tweeter is as excellent as Dyn's (which is the best/smoothest/most hypnotic I've heard).

    Be great to hear your views on it should you take the plunge, James.


    SS
    Last edited by SSM; 01-08-2012 at 12:18 PM.
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  20. #1840
    Founding Wammer SSM's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by HoopsOnToast View Post
    Be interesting to see how they compare to my LS3/5A competitors, the Kolts and my current 'new monitor' fav, the SCM7
    SA1 and Pee3 are limp lettuce next to the LS50, and SCM7 is dog-shit. And by extension of comparion, any Naim speaker is dog-shit with maggots in it.

    This LS50's real rivals are actually the B&W PM1 and ProAC Response D2 imo and ime.

    SS
    Last edited by SSM; 01-08-2012 at 12:19 PM.
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