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  1. #1
    Epsilon Male rockmeister's Avatar
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    IQ. How do you get it?

    The more I read, and the more I go and get involved with digital photography, the more I am sure that Image Quality is readily available to everyone cheaply and easily now, but the nuances, the very refined 'best of' for the pro's also requires the right kit.

    These are just some random Sunday thoughts, but if someone starting out asked me what they needed to do to produce top flight images I'd say, in order...

    Get a camera with AT LEAST an APC sized sensor. The Mp argument is less clear, but sensor size matters.

    Learn to use the camera properly, right from the very basics up. So many pics are spoilt by people who don't understand their tools.

    Buy good quality lenses. That is, make sure your glass will out resolve your sensor, or equal it.

    Love your subject and find time for it, not only on site, but in the 'darkroom' later.

    Learn post processing. At least get Lightroom or similar, but preferably get full photoshop and learn to use it.

    Shoot Raw.

    I'm talking here about aiming to exhibit your work in a gallery for example. I think there is a good arguement for saying bollox to most of the above and just taking snaps with a camera phone IF you are a goddam artistic genius.
    I'm not, so the above would be my route.
    You can't change the wind
    but you can alter the sails
    or eat less beans?

  2. #2
    Super Wammer
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    I try keep it simple (caus I'm stupid) with a little cropping (were needed)/contrast/brightness etc, and always always shoot jpeg, for me it works.




  3. #3
    Wammer grimep's Avatar
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    I was at Yeovilton Air Day last weekend and the amount of guys I saw with top of the range DSLRs with those HUGE grey Canon sports/zoom lenses on, hand-held and camera waving and wobbling around.... surely a large factor in IQ is sharpness and the best way to ensure that is a tripod??

  4. #4
    Super Wammer tkimages's Avatar
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    IQ comes in 2 flavours: Technical which most (all?) people can develop.
    Artistic which some people can develop.

    Combining both is the trick that needs to be learnt.
    Tillman
    http://www.tkimages.co.uk

    Marj, my wife and best friend, says my passions are obsessions.

  5. #5
    Super Wammer tkimages's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by grimep View Post
    I was at Yeovilton Air Day last weekend and the amount of guys I saw with top of the range DSLRs with those HUGE grey Canon sports/zoom lenses on, hand-held and camera waving and wobbling around.... surely a large factor in IQ is sharpness and the best way to ensure that is a tripod??
    A modern DSLR at a high ISO with a fast IS f2.8 or f4 lens will give high IQ images without a tripod as the shutter speed will quite high - providing the guys have the skills to hold them steady or pan steadily.
    Tillman
    http://www.tkimages.co.uk

    Marj, my wife and best friend, says my passions are obsessions.

  6. #6
    Wammer
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    I always tend to use tripod, remote release and work in the sweet spot of the lens. But then again, my subject matter doesn't really move. Decent glass made a huge difference for me.

  7. #7
    sq225917
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    it's by far more down to a good eye and technical skill than it is the gear.

  8. #8
    Super Wammer stickman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by grimep View Post
    I was at Yeovilton Air Day last weekend and the amount of guys I saw with top of the range DSLRs with those HUGE grey Canon sports/zoom lenses on, hand-held and camera waving and wobbling around.... surely a large factor in IQ is sharpness and the best way to ensure that is a tripod??
    I was at Duxford Flying Legends earlier today; one of those people holding a cream-coloured Canon lens (100-400mm in his case) was a mate of mine. I was using my Nikon 80-400. Neither of us used tripods, they're useless for flying aircraft unless you have a gimbal head and a lot of space around you.

    As TK says, choosing the appropriate shutter speed is the most important factor; although, with aircraft, just tracking and having the autofocus keep-up is the biggest issue.
    ...Romeo is bleeding, but you can't see his blood.

  9. #9
    Wammer grimep's Avatar
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    Heh, yeah, I managed to get a couple of OK shots with a hand-held compact, while carrying a four year old with the other arm who was a bit scared, most of em are just sky though!

    A few people had tripods set up, and all the pros around the pitch at the euro final last night had monopods at the least. I was reading a photography book the other day and the author reckoned that IQ starts with sharpness and without a support you're going to compromise it. I thought as it was a book on photography the author might know what he's talking about, though hey it might be bollocks these days.

  10. #10
    Super Wammer tkimages's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by grimep View Post
    ..... I was reading a photography book the other day and the author reckoned that IQ starts with sharpness and without a support you're going to compromise it. I thought as it was a book on photography the author might know what he's talking about, though hey it might be bollocks these days.

    Not really, just that on some occasions a tripod or mono pod is more of a hinderance and modern day technology such as image stabilisation and clean high ISO means you are not as reliant on a steady platform as you used to be.

    Having said that, sometimes a super sharp and detail image can take away from the visual/artistic merit of an image.
    Tillman
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    Marj, my wife and best friend, says my passions are obsessions.

  11. #11
    Super Wammer stickman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by grimep View Post
    Heh, yeah, I managed to get a couple of OK shots with a hand-held compact, while carrying a four year old with the other arm who was a bit scared, most of em are just sky though!

    A few people had tripods set up, and all the pros around the pitch at the euro final last night had monopods at the least. I was reading a photography book the other day and the author reckoned that IQ starts with sharpness and without a support you're going to compromise it. I thought as it was a book on photography the author might know what he's talking about, though hey it might be bollocks these days.
    A large full-frame DSLR with sports lens will probably weigh 6kg or more; putting it on a tripod means you don't have to hold it for 90 minutes.
    ...Romeo is bleeding, but you can't see his blood.

  12. #12
    Super Wammer
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    Buy a DSLR or a Leica as everything else is compromised. As an example my Fuiji x10 makes a great landscape camera, but as for moving subjects or repeatable and reliable focus wide open....forget it, maybe one day EVMs wll improve along with the shutters required, but not yet. Then get the best glass you can. Learn to get the shots right in camera and only ever go above LR3 if post processing is your artistic bag. Sh

    Shoot loads, spend quality time doing it and never be embarassed about shooting...not easy that last one, but get over your own sensabilities as soon as you can.

    As an aside, most decent digital cameras will get you 95% plus of the IQ of the best DSLRs and Leica for most of the presentaional and display methods that most people use...ie on line cropped JPEGs and A4 and below prints, 99% of viewers will not be able to tell the difference.

  13. #13
    Wammer
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    learn to control the medium so it's second nature, then go and make pictures, steer clear of photography forums and camera bores. look at art and film for inspiration.
    works for me :-)

  14. #14
    Moderator barneys dad's Avatar
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    Get your ass out of the house.
    Go to interesting places, where things are happening & shoot.
    Sometimes a slightly "punk attitude" is needed, go to places, take loads of shots, dont worry too much.
    And keep the camera with you, not at home in its bag/box*

    *note to self, I should do this more.

    I have the Olympic Torch relay coming through tomorrow, so i hope to god my shots are good.
    And it dont rain on my new toy*

    *5d mk2
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  15. #15
    Founding Wammer s2000db's Avatar
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    I believe you can get decent IQ out of an iphone, it's more about where and when you point the camera than what clobber you've got..

    imo the equipment only makes a difference depending on how large a final image you want..

  16. #16
    Interstellar Overdriver Sumdumgi's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MrSmith View Post
    learn to control the medium so it's second nature, then go and make pictures, steer clear of photography forums and camera bores. look at art and film for inspiration.
    works for me :-)
    Does your negativity towards Photography Forums include those within a HIFI Forum ?

    Photography Forums, just like those dedicated to other areas like cars, motorcycles, fishing, football and even HIFI have their fair share of twisty navel-gazing technophobes. However those same places are just as capable of providing helpful information, quality tips and inspiration to improve your subject knowledge and capabilities in your area of interest.

    I agree becoming fully technically competent and au fait with your equipment is essential - art & film are a source of inspiration but Forums can also provide the incentive to develop and try something new and creative and shouldn't be ignored.

    As for my take on IQ I couldn't have put it better than TK's post

  17. #17
    Grumpy sod steve rb's Avatar
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    Naaahhhh - Come on, the Nokia 808 has a 41MP camera now....

    "Don't wish for it, Work for it" www.bodyfitnesspt.com

  18. #18
    Super Wammer
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    Quote Originally Posted by s2000db View Post
    I believe you can get decent IQ out of an iphone, it's more about where and when you point the camera than what clobber you've got..

    imo the equipment only makes a difference depending on how large a final image you want..
    Even the print size is being squeezed up in terms of IQ available from cameras. The larger the image gets, the further away one stands to view it. Print dpi can be reduced and the image retains it's IQ from the viewing distance. Similar trickery has been used in painings for centuries, a 4/3 sensor should be able to render a decent 3ft by 2 ft image for the wall with no problems, just don't look critically from an unaturally close viewing position.

    I did have a good web link to this, will see if i can dig it out later.

    Hiding artefacts from lenses, such as softness at the edges and barrel/cushion distortion is more of an issue with these types of camera.

    IMHO, of course,

  19. #19
    Super Wammer tkimages's Avatar
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    If an image has that 'wow' factor or moves you emotionally then the technical merit of that image becomes less obvious and lens softness, lack of critical sharpness, grain, noise, etc., etc., have a less detrimental impact on the image.
    Tillman
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  20. #20
    Moderator barneys dad's Avatar
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    IQ. How do you get it?

    Its on bbc2 with that national treasure Stephen Fry.
    There's repeats on Dave.


    Did you hear about the dyslexic, agnostic?
    He didn't believe there was a dog.



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