Richard A

Mains purification/regeneration - worth considering?

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Super Dealer
4 hours ago, newlash09 said:

Half the boxes in my room are for power treatment. Apart from the highlighted items in the pic, there is a isotek power conditioner and another 3 LPSU hidden from view. 

Does it make a difference I don't know, I think it works for small power components like dac's and preamp etc...maybe it removes a little digital glare but Iam incapable as a critical listener to make out suck things. 

I think we all have an area of hifi we have a OCD about. For some it is isolators or cables....for me it is power treatment :D

Screenshot_20191020-161832_Gallery.jpg

Lovely shag pile carpet! 

On a practical note, do you have any air vents in the bottom plates of your valve amps? It might be worth lifting them up off the carpet to get some air flow. There will certainly be some caps in there which would prefer to not be hot. I use large rubber door stops to lift equipment about one and a half inches off the carpet. 

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13 hours ago, Fourlegs said:

Lovely shag pile carpet! 

On a practical note, do you have any air vents in the bottom plates of your valve amps? It might be worth lifting them up off the carpet to get some air flow. There will certainly be some caps in there which would prefer to not be hot. I use large rubber door stops to lift equipment about one and a half inches off the carpet. 

Hi fourlegs :)

Thanks for the advise. Iam still in the process of designing and building my rack to house the kit. The present placement on the floor is just a temporary arrangement. 

Even Iam presently using 4 inch wooden blocks to achieve some lift for the class A power amp which was getting heated up. Will check my tube amps as advised, and see if there is any air inlet underneath,  in which case will look for door stoppers or isolators to lift them too for better air circulation. Thanks again :)

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I promised some feedback from Joolz's bake off on this topic...

Jessica brought her Puritan mains conditioning block (the £1K model). We didnt do a 'with and without' except once when GLB wanted to see if it was reducing the Mastersound integrated (an 845 valved behemoth). I wasnt central in the listening area, but Bigfool (Dave - a judge) was, and he was adamant that the Mastersound was worse through the mains, and, when pushed, Chris (GLB) apparently grudgingly admitted he was right. (Chris was expecting a different result - so much for 'bias expectation')

In a conversation with Jessica she said the Puritan didnt do a lot at first but when combined with the leads from the same firm (£70 a throw) she was convinced. She added she wouldnt ever use her self designed and built phono stage without it now. (Hence we didnt take it out of the system wholesale.)

I have been trying to trace a 'chuntering' on one channel of my system and a bit of troubleshooting from a good mate resulted in us pointing the finger at the Virgin Media wifi which sends the signal via  the mains to the the room where the mainframe is situated. The clue was the 'chuntering had a pattern. Martin said it was a communication and so we concluded the router was the source.

Remedy? A Belkin AV conditioner that I had taken in part/ex for a valve phono stage some time ago, and which had been gathering dust on the landing.

I do believe it sounds better - that's a bonus, as they say in football. We plugged everything into it (including the Cary power amps) except the subs.

Jack

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Super Wammer

I was definitely impressed by Jessica's Puritan at Joolz's bake-off. It has DC blocking and passive noise filters. Hard to say which has the most effect, without a DC blocker only to hand to compare.

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I was definitely impressed by Jessica's Puritan at Joolz's bake-off. It has DC blocking and passive noise filters. Hard to say which has the most effect, without a DC blocker only to hand to compare.

I bought two  DC blockers from ATL Audio and installed them in front of my Isotek Titan and Nova mains conditioners and the effect on the whole system was way beyond expectation because I did not expect any improvement to sound quality at all , only reduced toroid noise caused by a small amount of DC  on the mains.

The step up in clarity and musical coherence was substantial and very pleasing !

https://www.atlhifi.com/shop/fully-assembled-devices/dc-blocker-trap-filter-assembled-in-case/

https://www.atlhifi.com/shop/fully-assembled-devices/high-power-dc-blocker-trap-filter-c20-ac-inlet-2-ac-outlets/

Edited by Electro
Added a bit .
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Not got to the bottom of this I feel.  No one out there who wouldn’t be without their mains regen?  I think it relevant that I have put separate power supplies on most of my kit - T/T, Chord DAC and Pre Amp and in each case the difference was positive and demonstrable.  Do I still need a Regen or would a regenerator have saved the individual power supplies?  I do recall a Demo in a hotel room where Isotech played the same ( modest) system, with and without their Power Unit ( sorry forgot which one) and the demo was impressive.

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I don't think you will get to the bottom of this. I've been trying to for some time without a definitive conclusion.

IMHO you just have to try in your own system and see what the results are...

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My experience with a regenerator started and finished when Lurch brought his Power Inspired over to mine about 18 months ago.

We listened to my system, which at the time had all valve amplification from phono stage to power amps, for a while and then tried plugging the sources and pre amp into the PI, there was a small difference - not sure if it was an improvement - but the conclusion we reached was that it was very small and not worth the cost of the additional unit. I then had the idea of running the power to my Quad 989s via the Power Inspired and I was immediately sold, there was was an improvement in the detail from the system and a greater dynamic range to the music that was so much better with the PI. I soon bought a second hand AG500, same as Johns, from that well known auction site and was delighted to find on arrival that it was in fact an AG1500 so a complete bargin and also capable of use with my complete system , including 845 mono block power amps.

So I guess my experience is it works better with some equipment than other.  

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Super Wammer

Yep wouldn't be without mine. Initially GLB plugged his PI AG500 into my kit (sources and pre only) and immediately heard more detail + sound was more spacious. Following it's use during keggy 2018 I bought it if of him, followed by a 2nd unit so I could also plumb in my valve monos (used this setup at Keggy this year)  I've since sold my pair of AG500s and bought AG1500S which I will be taking to keggy next March. 

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Just acquired my AG1500 through the classifieds. Thought I would give it a go as a number of you report good results.

My kit already has a dedicated mains spur that outputs dead on 240v. Vinyl only set up so TT p/s, head amp and phono all have mains plugs, plus my KT88 based integrated.

Been playing around with a few configurations over the past couple of hours. Early conclusions? With everything but the valve amp plugged in I like it, I get better dynamics that add drive and a bit more tonal body to electric guitar and brass. Feeling is that it may be benefiting the TT p/s the most, as these are attributes that would seem to correlate to better speed stability.

Plugging the amp in as well isn’t so good, just seems to lose some sparkle and zest, even after compensating for the slightly reduced output from 240hz to the 230hz from the AG1500.

Could be a keeper but more listening needed...
 

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Super Wammer
9 hours ago, lostwin said:

Plugging the amp in as well isn’t so good, just seems to lose some sparkle and zest, even after compensating for the slightly reduced output from 240v to the 230v from the AG1500.

Could be a keeper but more listening needed...
 

 You should be able to change the voltage from 230 to 240 via the menu

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Super Dealer
Posted (edited)
On 14/03/2020 at 00:26, lostwin said:

Just acquired my AG1500 through the classifieds. Thought I would give it a go as a number of you report good results.

My kit already has a dedicated mains spur that outputs dead on 240v. Vinyl only set up so TT p/s, head amp and phono all have mains plugs, plus my KT88 based integrated.

Been playing around with a few configurations over the past couple of hours. Early conclusions? With everything but the valve amp plugged in I like it, I get better dynamics that add drive and a bit more tonal body to electric guitar and brass. Feeling is that it may be benefiting the TT p/s the most, as these are attributes that would seem to correlate to better speed stability.

Plugging the amp in as well isn’t so good, just seems to lose some sparkle and zest, even after compensating for the slightly reduced output from 240hz to the 230hz from the AG1500.

Could be a keeper but more listening needed...
 

I had an AGS 1500S which I bought new from the company. I noticed a very sight harshening of the top end in the music and so sent it back to the company to get my money back stating that as the reason. I had everything except the power amps plugged into it. It was the sort of enhanced top end that might be mistaken for better dynamics but which for me was tiring after a while. This is very much a YMMV matter and I know that many people really like the AG1500 and AG1500S but it wasn't for me.

Edited by Fourlegs

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On 15/10/2019 at 18:26, Richard A said:

I tend to listen to my system during the afternoon. Sometime it sounds sublime, other days it does not seem quite as good.

It may be me that is different but I am wondering if fluctuations in the mains supply is causing these differences. So I am wondering what forum members think about mains purification or regeneration. I have no experience of either.

Worth considering or a waste of time and money? 

I welcome comments positive or negative.

I have no experience with mains regeneration or purification so cannot comment on those items. I do however have plenty of experience with balanced mains power supplies.

I followed the advice from Philip Newall`s book "Recording Studio Design" and built myself a balanced mains power supply using a 4KVA transformer to power the speakers and a 2KVA transformer to power the source components.

That has sorted all the mains problems out. No clicks and pops from various household appliances cycling on an off and no change in sound quality at any time during the day or night.

They are perfectly safe if built correctly.

MCB View complete 2.jpg

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