Paulssurround

What Are You Doing To Stay Healthy During the Covid-19 Crisis?

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Posted (edited)
38 minutes ago, Paulssurround said:

I watch this pandemic with great interest and at the different approaches by governments around the world.

Singapore was touted as an example of how to do it right, but that now appears to be premature.

The UK and US are on their own course.

Here in British Columbia, things look promising at the moment, but in Quebec and Ontario, not so much.

The model that interests me at the moment is the Swedish model. I don’t condone it, but it is gutsy 

Because of differences in the frequency of testing (as well as reporting on testing) and what relative timeline we're at on the r0 trajectory it's hard , and way too early, to say but looking at the numbers right now and comparing f.i. Norway with it's strict lockdown policy and Swe with the more 'liberal' approach; you will see that Norway has 86% of the number of reported cases of Sweden's with only 50% of the population. One would almost have expected the opposite, right? 

Edited by Clavius
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9 minutes ago, Paulssurround said:

I watch this pandemic with great interest and at the different approaches by governments around the world.

Singapore was touted as an example of how to do it right, but that now appears to be premature.

The UK and US are on their own course.

Here in British Columbia, things look promising at the moment, but in Quebec and Ontario, not so much.

The model that interests me at the moment is the Swedish model. I don’t condone it, but it is gutsy 

Glad to hear BC looks promising. Sweden however: the model is going down the drain and they have taken measures already. One of the measures is they corrected their statistics today, drastically and retroactively. They have been hit a bit later than others but this virus has no mercy. There is an important number called the infection rate R0. If one person infects 2 others on average then R0=2. The goal is to get it below 1 and some countries are there already but Sweden is not. An example: if R0 is 1,2 and starting from 1 after 50 days (50 is the known number of days since the first infection in Tyrolia) the number of infected is 9.100. If R0 is 1.4 and starting from 1 after 50 days the number of infected is…. 20.248.916. Research has no solid statistic base at the moment to say that for this virus R0 is about 15 like measles but an indication gives 3.9 at the beginning of the pandemic in Austria. In Italy probably more. So it is really important to get R0 down as early as possible but in Sweden's case I am afraid they missed the opportunity to get away with much less casualties. Because R0=1.4 after 10 days it is only 29 and maybe someone tends to underestimate.

I did not read the previous posts of this thread, I just jumped in because  Paul posted and I tend to read what he writes. :D  Thumbs up BC . And for all others as well.

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Posted (edited)
23 hours ago, golke53 said:

Glad to hear BC looks promising. Sweden however: the model is going down the drain and they have taken measures already. One of the measures is they corrected their statistics today, drastically and retroactively. They have been hit a bit later than others but this virus has no mercy. There is an important number called the infection rate R0. If one person infects 2 others on average then R0=2. The goal is to get it below 1 and some countries are there already but Sweden is not. An example: if R0 is 1,2 and starting from 1 after 50 days (50 is the known number of days since the first infection in Tyrolia) the number of infected is 9.100. If R0 is 1.4 and starting from 1 after 50 days the number of infected is…. 20.248.916. Research has no solid statistic base at the moment to say that for this virus R0 is about 15 like measles but an indication gives 3.9 at the beginning of the pandemic in Austria. In Italy probably more. So it is really important to get R0 down as early as possible but in Sweden's case I am afraid they missed the opportunity to get away with much less casualties. Because R0=1.4 after 10 days it is only 29 and maybe someone tends to underestimate.

I did not read the previous posts of this thread, I just jumped in because  Paul posted and I tend to read what he writes. :D  Thumbs up BC . And for all others as well.

Norway had its first infection 26 days before Sweden had its first. That would explain it. Norway's curve is flatter than Sweden's.

Correction edit: I've checked other data sources. I'm not sure about the 26 days. I'm seeing conflicting information, or I just don't know how to read graphs.

Edited by akamatsu

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21 minutes ago, Clavius said:

Because of differences in the frequency of testing (as well as reporting on testing) and what relative timeline we're at on the r0 trajectory it's hard , and way too early, to say but looking at the numbers right now and comparing f.i. Norway with it's strict lockdown policy and Swe with the more 'liberal' approach; you will see that Norway has 86% of the number of reported cases of Sweden's with only 50% of the population. One would almost have expected the opposite, right? 

My step-father was Swedish and Norwegian. I recall fondly many memories from my childhood all the interesting things I learned about the Scandinavian culture. That said, lutefisk and pigs feet were not one of them.

My visit with you almost 2 years ago to Sweden was fantastic, and really left a great impression on me. I absolutely loved my visit to Sweden 🇸🇪, thanks to you and your wife, as well as Magnus in Umeå.

I wish the best for Sweden, and hope that it turns out well. Maybe the cure is lutefisk, as it will certainly keep people from getting close to each other, and perhaps it has curative properties. I have seen a lot of potential remedies on the internet, including bananas, vitamin C, and even using a hair dryer to blow up your nose and kill the virus that way. I personally would prefer a vacuum to suck the virus right out of my sinus cavities and collect it with the built-in HEPA filter in my Dyson.

One of the most interesting articles I read was using sound waves at specific frequencies that would emulate the harmonic frequencies of the protein coat of the virus. The protein coat of the Covid-19 virus makes it almost stealth to our immune system. With specific harmonic frequencies, you can unravel the protein coat, making the genetic material of the virus now visible to our immune system, and subsequently destroyed quickly by our antibodies. Perhaps us music lovers have an advantage in fighting this virus compared to the rest of the population?
 

11 minutes ago, golke53 said:

Glad to hear BC looks promising. Sweden however: the model is going down the drain and they have taken measures already. One of the measures is they corrected their statistics today, drastically and retroactively. They have been hit a bit later than others but this virus has no mercy. There is an important number called the infection rate R0. If one person infects 2 others on average then R0=2. The goal is to get it below 1 and some countries are there already but Sweden is not. An example: if R0 is 1,2 and starting from 1 after 50 days (50 is the known number of days since the first infection in Tyrolia) the number of infected is 9.100. If R0 is 1.4 and starting from 1 after 50 days the number of infected is…. 20.248.916. Research has no solid statistic base at the moment to say that for this virus R0 is about 15 like measles but an indication gives 3.9 at the beginning of the pandemic in Austria. In Italy probably more. So it is really important to get R0 down as early as possible but in Sweden's case I am afraid they missed the opportunity to get away with much less casualties. Because R0=1.4 after 10 days it is only 29 and maybe someone tends to underestimate.

I did not read the previous posts of this thread, I just jumped in because  Paul posted and I tend to read what he writes. :D  Thumbs up BC . And for all others as well.

Very interesting reading about the infection rate numbers and how that correlates to the spread of the virus. Thank you Golke

My visit with you in Austria had a similar effect to my visit to Sweden. I absolutely loved every minute exploring Vienna, with you as a first rate tour guide and now a dear friend. 

I hope for the best for you and your family and hope we all come out of this okay. 

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Posted (edited)
45 minutes ago, Paulssurround said:

One of the most interesting articles I read was using sound waves at specific frequencies that would emulate the harmonic frequencies of the protein coat of the virus. The protein coat of the Covid-19 virus makes it almost stealth to our immune system. With specific harmonic frequencies, you can unravel the protein coat, making the genetic material of the virus now visible to our immune system, and subsequently destroyed quickly by our antibodies. Perhaps us music lovers have an advantage in fighting this virus compared to the rest of the population?

By "harmonic frequency" I think you mean resonant frequency or natural frequency.

The idea would be to expose the virus to a sound wave at the natural frequency of its outer protein coat causing it to resonate, thus destroying it. I would think that it would be a very high frequency sound wave.

Reminds me of the film "Mars Attacks."

Edited by akamatsu
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Presumably there are some cells in our body which would resonate at said frequency and therefore damage health cells

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Look mates, this is a serious matter and therefore I urge you all to help getting this number R  below 1. And when it is then do not believe it is over. It is under control if either we have vaccination for everyone or our populations have reached the so called herd immunity which is reached at approx 65% infection rate of the total population  in isolation. And even then we need a reliable treatment for those who remain seriously sick. The strict reduction of social contacts gets us to R < 1 if we keep discipline. But the pandemic will bounce back if we stop too early. Easily it gets reimported from neighboring countries. The numbers that I did not disclose in my previous post are like this: At R=1.4 and after 53 days the infection will be above 55 million and that is the threshold for herd immunity for a country like Germany. Seriously sick will be 20% of 55 million => 10.1 million. Even for a well organized country the health system will collapse and even higher mortal rates than in Italy may apply. In the case of Germany it would be minimum 1.3 million deaths. In the case of the USA with a population of 330 million count yourselves. In the case of India please forgive me, I cannot and do not. It made me shiver when I saw what Sweden did. Some "friends" of mine sent me Whatsapps with pseudo scientific essays about how overestimated this Corona pandemic is in compare to influenca. Medical doctors amongst them. I told them to go fly down to Italy and help and on their way sit down and learn the math behind exponential functions. Let's keep our fingers crossed and stay at home. We have the privilege to listen to great music systems if we feel  it is getting boring at home and that can save lives. All the best to all of us and good night from Vienna, a city of music.

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Posted (edited)

golke53,

I agree. I'm not leaving the house until the coast is clear. That is, I'll let everyone else go out first. If the virus doesn't spread again at that point, then, and only then, will I go out, wearing a mask for sure.

Stay safe, stay home,

Michael

Edited by akamatsu

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Despite being as careful as possible it seems my wife and I got the Covid 19, she a week after me.  It must be really terrible infectious.
Lucky us it was a very mild infection with no fever. We only noticed when we both developed the same symptoms (a bit of pain in the chest when breathing deeply). I even went jogging and was a little surprised when my Garmin told me that my slow jog was way too exhausting and I should rest for 72 hours. Guess my body was already busy with fighting the virus.
Took in total about two weeks until the symptoms disappeared.

Hopefully there is soon a reliable test for proving it was Covid and we are immune for a while, so we can help others.

Stay safe

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12 hours ago, akamatsu said:

By "harmonic frequency" I think you mean resonant frequency or natural frequency.

The idea would be to expose the virus to a sound wave at the natural frequency of its outer protein coat causing it to resonate, thus destroying it. I would think that it would be a very high frequency sound wave.

Reminds me of the film "Mars Attacks."

Actually, it was a low frequency exposure to the Covid-19  virus in the 200 hertz range.

The research used 2 specific frequencies beamed simultaneously at the virus. I have no idea of the validity of the research, but I find the process interesting.

As the protein coat started to disintegrate, the bodies defences were able to identify the invading viruses and inactivate it

10 hours ago, Nrwatson said:

Presumably there are some cells in our body which would resonate at said frequency and therefore damage health cells

I’m not sure if it would damage healthy cells.
 

As you know better than I, our body is generally efficient at healing itself, whereas viruses don’t have an ability to repair themselves if they  are damaged?

6 hours ago, akamatsu said:

golke53,

I agree. I'm not leaving the house until the coast is clear. That is, I'll let everyone else go out first. If the virus doesn't spread again at that point, then, and only then, will I go out, wearing a mask for sure.

Stay safe, stay home,

Michael

I agree your approach is prudent, but I would be equally vigilant about ensuring I do everything I can to boast my immune system.

As you can see from Baba Yaga’s post above, we may still be exposed in other ways, no matter how careful we are, and I want to give it my best to fight the virus with a stronger immune system.

11 minutes ago, Baba Yaga said:

Despite being as careful as possible it seems my wife and I got the Covid 19, she a week after me.  It must be really terrible infectious.
Lucky us it was a very mild infection with no fever. We only noticed when we both developed the same symptoms (a bit of pain in the chest when breathing deeply). I even went jogging and was a little surprised when my Garmin told me that my slow jog was way too exhausting and I should rest for 72 hours. Guess my body was already busy with fighting the virus.
Took in total about two weeks until the symptoms disappeared.

Hopefully there is soon a reliable test for proving it was Covid and we are immune for a while, so we can help others.

Stay safe

I hope you and your wife stay healthy and recovering fully.

Take care

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Posted (edited)

Happy to hear about your mild symptoms and recovery Baba Yaga, counting two more towards heard immunity ! People tend to forget that in order to be immune you first have to have been infected... 

14 hours ago, golke53 said:

Sweden however: the model is going down the drain and they have taken measures already. One of the measures is they corrected their statistics today, drastically and retroactively. They have been hit a bit later than others but this virus has no mercy.

With all due respect Golke and please excuse me for asking, but is this opinion formed from direct experience or from other sources? 

I think the difference in approach has been very much played up in media. This is mainly due to a fundamental misunderstanding of social factors coupled with the need for stories and that old favorite; the preconceived notion of “Swedish exceptionalism”. There is however in my experience one very real factor that makes Sweden an outlier,  Swedes tend to trust in experts and follow authorities. The amount of restrictions are strictly decided by scientists and merely  executed by politicians. One such example is the edict of widespread use of face masks in the population, no scientific evidence of surgical masks being useful - no ruling of the use of face masks.

Simply stated there is less need for draconian measures in Swedish society.

From what I can see personally here in Stockholm the streets are pretty much as abandoned as f.i. in Paris, San Francisco, Los Angeles or the Cotswolds where I’m touch with people professionally or socially on a daily basis. 

As I said above, there simply is way to much noise in the data to draw any conclusions right now. Let’s not jump to conclusions based on pop science and old preconceived notions. The r0 numbers are entirely dependent on the amount of tests and the accuracy of reporting. 

Edited by Clavius

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23 minutes ago, Clavius said:

Happy to hear about your mild symptoms and recovery Baba Yaga, counting two more towards heard immunity ! People tend to forget that in order to be immune you first have to have been infected... 

With all due respect Golke and please excuse me for asking, but is this opinion formed from direct experience or from other sources? 

I think the difference in approach has been very much played up in media. This is mainly due to a fundamental misunderstanding of social factors coupled with the need for stories and that old favorite; the preconceived notion of “Swedish exceptionalism”. There is however in my experience one very real factor that makes Sweden an outlier,  Swedes tend to trust in experts and follow authorities. The amount of restrictions are strictly decided by scientists and merely  executed by politicians. One such example is the edict of widespread use of face masks in the population, no scientific evidence of surgical masks being useful - no ruling of the use of face masks.

Simply stated there is less need for draconian measures in Swedish society.

From what I can see personally here in Stockholm the streets are pretty much as abandoned as f.i. in Paris, San Francisco, Los Angeles or the Cotswolds where I’m touch with people professionally or socially on a daily basis. 

As I said above, there simply is way to much noise in the data to draw any conclusions right now. Let’s not jump to conclusions based on pop science and old preconceived notions. The r0 numbers are entirely dependent on the amount of tests and the accuracy of reporting. 

Sweden just corrected statistics yesterday. Not to the better unfortunately and it was obvious on TV yesterday that the government is having 2nd thoughts. I hope all the best for you and your families. Not shutting down schools and kindergartens in time was a big mistake. It is known that the rate R in closed groups is > 3 implying a class of 27 pupils gets 100% infection in 3 days. Most younger people show no symptoms or very mild symptoms but they spread it and from school they take it to their homes where it takes up to another 2 weeks before the families recognize what they have got. That is how it gets even to rural areas: sending kids to school. In the maths I have own expertise so I double check what government tells me. You may test  with some easy numbers: if the number of new infections is more than the number of recovered day over day then R > 1. If doubling infections takes 2 days then R > 1.4, if doubling takes 3.8 days then R = 1.2. Break even is at around 10 days depending on how efficient the health system is.  I would rely on official country statistics and John Hopkins. Good luck and take care.

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3 hours ago, Baba Yaga said:

Despite being as careful as possible it seems my wife and I got the Covid 19, she a week after me.  It must be really terrible infectious.
Lucky us it was a very mild infection with no fever. We only noticed when we both developed the same symptoms (a bit of pain in the chest when breathing deeply). I even went jogging and was a little surprised when my Garmin told me that my slow jog was way too exhausting and I should rest for 72 hours. Guess my body was already busy with fighting the virus.
Took in total about two weeks until the symptoms disappeared.

Hopefully there is soon a reliable test for proving it was Covid and we are immune for a while, so we can help others.

Stay safe

Ignore if privacy concerns are paramount. Baba, can you say what part of the world are you in? Did the authorities do any contact tracing with you? Do you know where, when, how, who by you were infected? You're the first here, so I'm curious.

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We are based in the vicinity of Hamburg, Germany. I have no clue where I was infected, reducing contact to the absolute minimum, wearing gloves, keeping distance, brief contact to only a few people and staying at home most of the time. I suspect it may the at the doctor when I got a pneumococcal vaccination or at the pharmacy when I picked up the shot but thats only a wild guess. We were not contacted yet and I doubt we will as tests will be prioritized for system relevant people or seriously ill patients.

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10 hours ago, Baba Yaga said:

Despite being as careful as possible it seems my wife and I got the Covid 19, she a week after me.  It must be really terrible infectious.
Lucky us it was a very mild infection with no fever. We only noticed when we both developed the same symptoms (a bit of pain in the chest when breathing deeply). I even went jogging and was a little surprised when my Garmin told me that my slow jog was way too exhausting and I should rest for 72 hours. Guess my body was already busy with fighting the virus.
Took in total about two weeks until the symptoms disappeared.

Hopefully there is soon a reliable test for proving it was Covid and we are immune for a while, so we can help others.

Stay safe

Sorry that you aren't feeling well. I can only imagine the discomfort and fear. I've recently read that it's possible that initial level of exposure to the virus can impact the severity of illness. This could explain why some cases are more severe than others. Wearing a mask in public could reduce the amount of virus entering the body at the moment of transmission. It seems to be a race between virus replication and immune response.

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