mr neds

PayPal friends and family- where is It?

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41 minutes ago, AV8 said:

 No he didn't, he received it without any fees.

you got lucky

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36 minutes ago, stevebrown said:

you got lucky

Not really. Paypal just give you a lousy currency rate so you have to factor that in if you want the recipient to receive a certain amount.

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Posted (edited)
8 hours ago, stevebrown said:

If you pay bank transfer, so long as you have proof of who you are dealing with you have far more recourse under UK law than the kangaroo and illegal court of paypal will ever give to you

Are you sure about this? 

Within banking apps there are now various "are you sure" type warnings before you make a transfer to a person. 

If there was an issue then I imagine the bank would just tell you tough luck etc. but perhaps I'm being too negative on banks.

My personal preference is BT and I would only buy from an established wammer. Or if using ebay, from someone with decent feedback.

Re PayPal-  I've had an issue with a purchase previously and paypal were absolutely top notch... I'd bought some funky Tshirts on a whim, from a site I'd never heard of or used before. Not posted and no contact in 8 days and I then looked up reviews for said company, which appeared to be some kind of a money spinning scam company, with endless pages of 1* reviews from dissatisfied customers. Put in a paypal claim about 8pm and had the money returned to me by midday the next day. Very impressed!

EDIT: if using PPf&f removes buyer protection (?), I can't see why anyone would do this. Just pay the extra to seller so if it goes awol etc. you're covered. 99% of sellers are legit anyway so surely wouldn't mind. Perhaps I'm missing something here!

Edited by Amormusic

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Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, stevebrown said:

you got lucky

Wasn't lucky at all, I sent it by Paypal friend & relative, it showed me all the way up to checkout what the conversion cost was from £ to CHF then the fee to convert at £1.80.

It is you who is wrong.

Edited by AV8

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Moderator

I use PayPal f&f or bank transfer for people here who I know well enough. For anyone I've not bought anything from previously, I'd use 'proper' PayPal and offer to pay the fees if necessary. Certainly if it's a reasonable amount of money.

Bank transfer can potentially be reclaimed, but it's messy and difficult and you have to have a cast iron case, because banks are banks, not a selling platform, so understandably don't want to get involved in any 'dispute'. If you use bank transfer and the good arrive faulty, I wish you luck trying to claw back the payment.

I don't like PayPal, but as a buyer it gives more protection than any alternative frankly.

  • Upvote 1

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Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, rabski said:

I don't like PayPal, but as a buyer it gives more protection than any alternative frankly.

i thought that but after over 10 years of usage and passing well over 100k through it i suffered a fraud and they basically said screw you after wasting 6 months deliberating it and not giving me any info or access to the opposing sides presented info after the intital 1 line complaint.

If i hadn`t wasted my time and effort with Paypal ajudicating i could have gone to court in the UK far quicker and with total transparency

The internet is full of complaints of people who hate Paypal, like me you probably never check until it happens to you 

Edited by stevebrown

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I for one have been very nearly stung by a couple of chancers on AOS.

"Bought" a Marantz CD63 KI sig from a fairly new member (Karlmar) for about £130 inc delivery, but paid friends and family into an account I'd seen lots of sales and feedback for (I will name - pzblues) - both have been banned from AOS.

Never received the CD player.

Probably 80 emails passed between me and the two parties - pzblues always promising to repay the money despite it not being him (but his father in law) selling the player.

No money ever received - until I managed to get his address.

Some of the emails were quite funny, as I said I had his postcode...to which he replied "you'll have to do better than that"

Then I sent him his addressxD

I offered to pop round and collect the money...low and behold the the £130 was refunded.

I dont tend to use friends and family now, unless its someone I've met or know.

For the sake of £4 on £100 I can tell you its well worth paying to avoid the sickening feeling you get when you've been stung.

Just my two-penneth, but sometimes its worth paying a bit extra for the peace of mind.

Saying the I've had loads of great deals with many very honest people on here, AOS and PFM.

You take your choice and have to make a judgement call...I'd tend to use PayPal as a safe bet for the sake of an extra 4% on lowish value items.

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7 minutes ago, ducattiist said:

I offered to pop round and collect the money...low and behold the the £130 was refunded.

...exchange some pleasantries and tell him what a spiffingly honourable gentleman he was and how lucky you were to have passed his acquaintance 😉.

That made me laugh 😂

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2 minutes ago, Amormusic said:

...exchange some pleasantries and tell him what a spiffingly honourable gentleman he was and how lucky you were to have passed his acquaintance 😉.

That made me laugh 😂

Indeed...the emails were quite funny!

I thought I'd lost the money...but kept badgering him because he was fairly local to me.

I even found a photo of him and his missus and told him that.

His reply..."I think thats a bit unethical grabbing a photo of me!"

My reply was "taking £130 off me was unethical"

Everything was sorted eventually, but the sour taste remains...its strange that ONE bad experience can ruin so much trust.

I've never been scammed on any of the hifi forums until this, but its still a sticking point for me.

To be fair...I've dealt with tons of great guys on these sites for about 15yrs, then one comes along and ruins it.:cs:

I think I'm over it now though!

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Some dangerous nonsense being written here. 

It certainly not any safer using a bank transfer vs PP via either F&F or goods. No scammer uses a bank account in their own name. They use mules, and there are several layers of accounts before the money ends up with the scammer, or someone directly associated with them. You can complain to the recipient bank, following a rule change in early 2019. But the chances of that yielding a happy result are very slim. The money will be long gone and the responsibilities of the receiving bank to the sender are v limited. 

PP is Luxembourg domiciled, is regulated for its activities here and under the VJ of the financial ombudsman. And is linked to you bank account or credit card. So it offers fairly similar (i.e. very limited) protection. 

PP goods gives you some protection, as per PP's T&C's. But those T&C's offer far from watertight protection and if PP can't recover the money from the "seller" you might still be left high and dry. 

I assume stevebrown is referring to the possibility of making a civil claim for money owed. I don't understand the distinction he is attempting to make between the payment mediums - there is no such distinction that I'm aware of. And if you're dealing with a scammer, you won't know who you've sent the money to - although you might think you do. Scammers are sophisticated - good luck finding someone to take action against. 

Lots of people have axes to grind when service providers fall short of their expectations. But PP is no worse or better than than banks in that regard, in my experience. UK banks are facilitating hundreds of millions of £££ in APP fraud currently. Ask a victim what they think of their experiences with the bank(s) involved. an internet search for any provider and "fraud" will reveal streams of vitriol. 

The focus should be on using common sense and taking responsibility for protecting yourself, rather than an expectation of the provider of the payment medium used giving you a safety net. 

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Super Wammer
1 hour ago, ducattiist said:

You take your choice and have to make a judgement call...I'd tend to use PayPal as a safe bet for the sake of an extra 4% on lowish value items.

I use PayPal a lot, quite happily. But the fees thing is not at the buyer’s discretion, it’s at the seller’s (the context of your post suggests you were commenting as a buyer). As a buyer, you would have to agree with the seller that you were willing to pay 4% more if he/she agreed to PayPal purchase and then send that higher amount.

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Super Wammer

I may be missing something but a number of posts above have continued to use the old (I think) terminology. AFAIK it is now called PayPal Gift (or PPG for short I guess).

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Whereas I thought the name had changed from PPG to PPF&F

Sent from my HRY-LX1 using Tapatalk

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Super Wammer

It now seems to be Send with Buyer Protection or Send to Someone You Trust. 

I guess we’ll all just make our own words up then!

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