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4 minutes ago, dikki said:

Okay. Can that be because maybe you're using the sound enhancing abilities of Roon? What happens if you don't? I would like to use Roon only for the aggregation (tagging, cataloguing, etc) functionality. Would that be any different? 

I used no DSP at all, as I already have SO (MDSM at the flat). I’d recommend you try the trial on your NAS, though - you may have better luck than I did.

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roon seamlessly integrates your collection with Qobuz/tidal. the interface is better it's more stable To be honest I think you're just better using the free trial and trying it for your

I was very lucky - I bought lifetime a few weeks before they put it up. Even so, it was a lot of money, but even now, sixteen months later, I have no regrets.  It wouldn’t have been for me if they d

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2 hours ago, dikki said:In that sense, I do have the Qnap 251+ NAS. Roon says that is too light to run the Roon core. I read here it is possible. What  are the experiences with that setup? I suppose I can try, and I will, but I'm just curious about experiences here. 

I run Roon on a QNAP TS251+ with no problem and no lagging or drop outs. Scrolling through my own music and Qobuz is fast with no issues. Only thing I did, was upgrade the onboard RAM to 8GB.

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14 minutes ago, Billz said:

I run Roon on a QNAP TS251+ with no problem and no lagging or drop outs. Scrolling through my own music and Qobuz is fast with no issues. Only thing I did, was upgrade the onboard RAM to 8GB.

I don’t know if @dikkihas the HS or TS version. The memory in the HS can’t be upgraded - I’m stuck with 2GB.

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4 hours ago, MickC said:

I don’t know if @dikkihas the HS or TS version. The memory in the HS can’t be upgraded - I’m stuck with 2GB.

Roon was slow and clunky when I first tried it with 4GB RAM on board. I had spare RAM lying about from an old Laptop (2 x 4GB) and installed it in my TS251+. Roon performs fine with 8GB on board. If @dikki can add more RAM then he should be good to go with Roon. 

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I'm curious because I've not ever personally done the comparison - are there sound quality concerns with Roon and Linn?

I know from other forums and conversations that there are quite a few people who have said that Roon sounds worse than other solutions. Not with Linn specifically, but just in general.

Essentially with Roon the player component is on the computer running the Roon Core, so I'm just curious what that sounds like compared to a pull-based solution in which the Linn player software handles everything. 

I tried Roon with other products a few years ago but was less than impressed; I am not a fan of the UI much at all actually. An interface which scrolls sideways instead of vertically is counter-intuitive, and quite frankly while I am music fanatic I can find my own little details about artists and such on my own. I have the internet.

And despite what people may love about the metadata, the fact is I can purchase Perfect Tunes, Bliss, Jaikoz, or any number of other programs for a fraction of the price to comb through my metadata and properly tag my music files, add album art, etc. - and the edits are permanent.

A file indexer providing an overlay for a poorly tagged local music library that requires one to pay a subscription, and should one fail to renew, at the end of the day leaves one with the same poorly tagged files one had to begin with, doesn't really solve anyone's problems. 

And I'm simply not going to pay $120 or $500 just so that I can have Tidal and Qobuz integration, which is what everyone really seems to use it for these days. 

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11 minutes ago, Elad Repooc said:

I can purchase Perfect Tunes, Bliss, Jaikoz, or any number of other programs for a fraction of the price to comb through my metadata and properly tag my music files, add album art, etc. -

You can also use the free LyricFinder to add lyrics to lots of songs. 

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8 hours ago, Elad Repooc said:

I'm curious because I've not ever personally done the comparison - are there sound quality concerns with Roon and Linn?

I know from other forums and conversations that there are quite a few people who have said that Roon sounds worse than other solutions. Not with Linn specifically, but just in general.

Essentially with Roon the player component is on the computer running the Roon Core, so I'm just curious what that sounds like compared to a pull-based solution in which the Linn player software handles everything. 

I tried Roon with other products a few years ago but was less than impressed; I am not a fan of the UI much at all actually. An interface which scrolls sideways instead of vertically is counter-intuitive, and quite frankly while I am music fanatic I can find my own little details about artists and such on my own. I have the internet.

And despite what people may love about the metadata, the fact is I can purchase Perfect Tunes, Bliss, Jaikoz, or any number of other programs for a fraction of the price to comb through my metadata and properly tag my music files, add album art, etc. - and the edits are permanent.

A file indexer providing an overlay for a poorly tagged local music library that requires one to pay a subscription, and should one fail to renew, at the end of the day leaves one with the same poorly tagged files one had to begin with, doesn't really solve anyone's problems. 

And I'm simply not going to pay $120 or $500 just so that I can have Tidal and Qobuz integration, which is what everyone really seems to use it for these days. 

I too have read folk saying it sounds worse, so I tried a few experiments early on but could hear no difference. However, I can also hear no difference between the same file streamed as WAV or FLAC, which many claim to hear, so maybe my hearing's at fault there - who knows?

As far as leaving poorly tagged files untouched - that's a good thing, surely? Otherwise *all* files could be interfered with. As long as Roon manages to identify an album correctly, it'll display it correctly - all associated info is kept in Roon's database, with the actual files left alone.

The streaming service integration is very good indeed, and any albums in Qobuz (I don't use Tidal) I 'favourite' are seamlessly integrated into my library.

Roon Radio, a service that tries to find music similar to that you've been playing, is wonderful (I appreciate less so for some). I'll play music of my choice, and when it ends, Roon will find music it thinks is similar, that I may like, from within Qobuz'z 70m+ songs. It's introduced me to many an artist I've grown to love. Also, for any radio station with metadata (ususally but not always Radio Paradise here) Roon will display the artist, song title and name of the album the song is available on, so I can then go straight to that album, or to the artist, where I can see the artist's discography, and select something from there.

If you've not tried Roon for some years, I'd recommend another go - it's likely that the way it handles radio stations with metadata, and also the Roon Radio feature, were not available when you tried, as they're fairly recent additions.

As a closer, in case anyone thinks I'm an unthinking, unseeing Roon fanboy, I do have issues with it - Roon's handling of large box sets could be better - I'd like per-disc artwork rather than the same artwork across all discs in the set, and also the fact that Roon won't recognise per track genres, only per album, which means if I have compilations with tracks that could be individually labelled as, say, folk, rock and reggae, every track on that album will have all these genres assigned to it, so running a shuffle of reggae could end up with a folk or rock track from a compilation. That said, I only have a few compilations, but it does irritate somewhat on the odd occasion it happens. The latest update - 1.8 - has had artist pictures changed from rectangular to round, which wouldn't be an issue except with some artists' pictures only a knee or an elbow is visible in the circle! The folk at Roon are, apparently, working on this last issue though.

Despite these last comments, I have no regrets at all about the cost of use as I find I get a lot of benefit from it. It's not for everyone, clearly, but it is for me. The few occasions where I've dropped back to Kazoo or the Linn App has made me very aware of the gulf between the two systems.

Mick

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14 hours ago, Elad Repooc said:

I tried Roon with other products a few years ago but was less than impressed; I am not a fan of the UI much at all actually. An interface which scrolls sideways instead of vertically is counter-intuitive

They changed that in version 1.8.  But the library mgmt has just degraded dramatically. You dont find things anymore because they clutter the UI everywhere with totally useless „Top“ and „Popular“ suggestions. Its also just sooo full of bugs. Feels like early beta. I put it on the side for now to see whether they eventually manage to sort out their code mess.

Edited by MakesNoSense
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6 hours ago, MickC said:

As a closer, in case anyone thinks I'm an unthinking, unseeing Roon fanboy, I do have issues with it - Roon's handling of large box sets could be better - I'd like per-disc artwork rather than the same artwork across all discs in the set, and also the fact that Roon won't recognise per track genres, only per album, which means if I have compilations with tracks that could be individually labelled as, say, folk, rock and reggae, every track on that album will have all these genres assigned to it, so running a shuffle of reggae could end up with a folk or rock track from a compilation. That said, I only have a few compilations, but it does irritate somewhat on the odd occasion it happens. The latest update - 1.8 - has had artist pictures changed from rectangular to round, which wouldn't be an issue except with some artists' pictures only a knee or an elbow is visible in the circle! The folk at Roon are, apparently, working on this last issue though.

Hmm... I am using that a lot on minim server. I like that it allows me to define different genres within an album. I use that a lot for classical music, where a pianoconcerto is quite something else than a symphony. 

21 hours ago, MickC said:

I don’t know if @dikkihas the HS or TS version. The memory in the HS can’t be upgraded - I’m stuck with 2GB.

I'm afraid I have the HS version, and it is already complaining about memory use, and I only have one album in the library at this moment (more is on the way: I'm still ripping the cds). 

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3 minutes ago, dikki said:

Hmm... I am using that a lot on minim server. I like that it allows me to define different genres within an album. I use that a lot for classical music, where a pianoconcerto is quite something else than a symphony. 

I'm afraid I have the HS version, and it is already complaining about memory use, and I only have one album in the library at this moment (more is on the way: I'm still ripping the cds). 

I think Roon may be of less use to the keen classical listener. Probably ten percent, or less, of my listening is classical, so I only have 'classical' as the genre for those, which makes it straightforward for me. Roon does add more types within the classical genre.

I think it might be worth running a trial of Roon on a PC or Mac, just to find out if it's the kind of thing that works for you or not. The HS251+ won't give a good enough experience.

Mick

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3 minutes ago, MickC said:

I think Roon may be of less use to the keen classical listener. Probably ten percent, or less, of my listening is classical, so I only have 'classical' as the genre for those, which makes it straightforward for me. Roon does add more types within the classical genre.

Oh, it definitely adds to my listening pleasure. It allows me to find new recordings more easily. Also, something that the Linn app does a terrible job with: grouping of titles. Roon does a good job at that, Linn is totally ignoring it in their app. I have to go to the Qobuz app to see what "Allegro" actually means (being the nth part of a concerto). 

Minimserver does that very well btw, and I can also force Linn to pick it up with that, by some clever tagging. But then I am missing the links between albums that Roon offers. 

I guess nothing is perfect huh? 

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I use Roon. To be honest, I’ve not noticed any bugs with the latest version. Probably because I’m not a very demanding user. My main reason for preferring Roon is that it works identically and seamlessly for my Linn system, my Devialet system and my wireless speaker in the bedroom. Simple for me and my family. 
Oh, and I’ve taken the liberty of adding a bit of bass shelf that’s missing in SO2.
I don’t have any performance issues but I’m running on a fully loaded QNAP TVS-672N. 

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5 hours ago, MickC said:

I think Roon may be of less use to the keen classical listener.

Thats not quite in line with their promotional material, though, where they keep bragging about „understanding“ classical music and how good they are organizing everything by composer, composition etc. Certainly not what I experienced.

Edited by MakesNoSense
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