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Keltik vs M140


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6 minutes ago, zee9 said:

The more I read this thread the more I feel I should have opted for keltiks instead of the 242’s.

Don’t get me wrong. I Just spent an hour listening to my kabers and katans and decided i’ll never sell the kabers but last week I thought I should sell the Kan II’s instead of the katans. All those 3 speakers with the katans being at the bottom of the list sound more warm and romantic than clinical. Then I come back to my 242’s and just love the presence, the bass and the detail. If I could just get them to be a bit warmer id be a happy camper but I think that’s the main difference between the old and new linn sound. I maybe wrong but that’s what I feel.

In hearing the older speakers I do feel that a standpoint can’t replace a floor stander. So my advice is to hear the akudoriks before you sell the keltiks and if you really like/love the 3k sound then you’re probably going to need a full system revamp and get the akubariks with 10 channels

PS - the gentleman who bought my ninkas and my c5100 is coming over today to hear the aktiv 242’s. I’ll let you know his thoughts between the regular tweeter and 3k arrays as soon as i can. I’m curious what he will say.

Adsm/1 >> Akurate 4200/3200/3200 >> Aktiv Akurate 242 (mark 1) Silvers/K400

Thanks Zee. I'm absolutely loving the Ketiks in my ASH/AEB-I setup. It's certainly a relaxed rich sound that I'm currently really enjoying. My worry is, if I listen to the Akudorik and like what it offers then I'll just want the Akubariks. Then the costs go up considerably when I need more amplification to power those beasts! Perhaps what you're after is unobtainable? You want bass and detail but warmth too. Is that possible? I don't know. Must be surely. But with what?

Mike.

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29 minutes ago, zee9 said:

The more I read this thread the more I feel I should have opted for keltiks instead of the 242’s.

Don’t get me wrong. I Just spent an hour listening to my kabers and katans and decided i’ll never sell the kabers but last week I thought I should sell the Kan II’s instead of the katans. All those 3 speakers with the katans being at the bottom of the list sound more warm and romantic than clinical. Then I come back to my 242’s and just love the presence, the bass and the detail. If I could just get them to be a bit warmer id be a happy camper but I think that’s the main difference between the old and new linn sound. I maybe wrong but that’s what I feel.

In hearing the older speakers I do feel that a standpoint can’t replace a floor stander. So my advice is to hear the akudoriks before you sell the keltiks and if you really like/love the 3k sound then you’re probably going to need a full system revamp and get the akubariks with 10 channels

PS - the gentleman who bought my ninkas and my c5100 is coming over today to hear the aktiv 242’s. I’ll let you know his thoughts between the regular tweeter and 3k arrays as soon as i can. I’m curious what he will say.

Adsm/1 >> Akurate 4200/3200/3200 >> Aktiv Akurate 242 (mark 1) Silvers/K400

Is your Katalyst upgrade already in your system?

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Is your Katalyst upgrade already in your system?

It’s ordered but not yet arrived :(


Adsm/1 >> Akurate 4200/3200/3200 >> Aktiv Akurate 242 (mark 1) Silvers/K400
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9 minutes ago, zee9 said:


It’s ordered but not yet arrived :(


Adsm/1 >> Akurate 4200/3200/3200 >> Aktiv Akurate 242 (mark 1) Silvers/K400

Zee, I'd love to hear your thoughts once you have the Katalyst upgrade installed.

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On 12/05/2021 at 04:10, SnapperMike said:

Many thanks. So Bass 1 on the AEB-I to the far left pair of inputs on the Keltiks?

Anyone else with experience of connecting a AEB-I to Keltiks able to confirm?

@teuchter85 @fredbatch @Suffolkboy@Fallguy @CJ1045

Cheers, Mike.

IMG_5519.JPG

Screenshot 2021-05-11 at 21.27.09.png

Just catching up on this thread!. That is what I did also and with the same "logic".

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5 hours ago, Pennypacker said:

The double adhesive tape that was on it already was still sticky enough for me. So I did not add anything.

When I decided to tighten up the drivers on my Keltiks it was pretty obvious that the previous owner had taken the rings off at some point and had done a pretty poor job of reattaching them with hot glue. I removed all the hot glue and the original factory applied double sided tape (a very tedious process I might add) and applied fresh double sided tape, which worked great.

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Just an update: the gentleman who bought my ninkas and is now running them aktiv with an mdsm/3 and an akurate level lp12 said that he has not heard detail and soundstage like mine before in his life. He did not find my speakers clinical and was shocked at how real it made the music sound. I asked if he felt the lack of warmth and he said try an lp12 as a source which leaves me with no definitive answer.

Once I do have the katalyst upgrade I think my direction will become more clear.


Adsm/1 >> Akurate 4200/3200/3200 >> Aktiv Akurate 242 (mark 1) Silvers/K400

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4 hours ago, zee9 said:

Just an update: the gentleman who bought my ninkas and is now running them aktiv with an mdsm/3 and an akurate level lp12 said that he has not heard detail and soundstage like mine before in his life. He did not find my speakers clinical and was shocked at how real it made the music sound. I asked if he felt the lack of warmth and he said try an lp12 as a source which leaves me with no definitive answer.

Once I do have the katalyst upgrade I think my direction will become more clear.


Adsm/1 >> Akurate 4200/3200/3200 >> Aktiv Akurate 242 (mark 1) Silvers/K400

probably the direction of the record store after you bought an LP12 🤪

In al seriousness, the Katalyst upgrade would be kind of the last resort to clean up any harshness and maybe ad some warmth. 

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Posted (edited)
14 minutes ago, Pennypacker said:

probably the direction of the record store after you bought an LP12 🤪

In al seriousness, the Katalyst upgrade would be kind of the last resort to clean up any harshness and maybe ad some warmth. 

And passive with a tundra, never liked mk1 242 aktiv, too clinical and cold. Mk2 were fine.

Edited by Suffolkboy
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22 hours ago, Pennypacker said:

It took some headscratching and sweat of fear. But this is how it seems to be fastened: 

Both of the rings of the lower and midrange are glued for the driver chassis, pleas note that the lower ring is made from wood. In my case the lower came loose by seeking a loosened corner and the working your way around it.

FE739BE3-CB46-4B7E-A63A-4655D0851F8D.jpeg

B0AA25A4-CD25-49F7-B2D5-451AA8855CDF.jpeg

Thanks @Pennypacker I've now tightened everything up as you described. Very straight forward but I'm pleased you told me to have a table ready to rest the outer bass drive. I didn't expect it to be so heavy!

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  • 2 weeks later...
Posted (edited)

@Pennypackeras I've now had my Keltiks for a couple of weeks I thought I'd offer some further thoughts and I'd be keen to hear yours in return.

What I initially thought of as recessed vocals I don't actually think is true. For sure, they are more recessed than the Ninkas but I really think that the vocals are now really well presented. I have the female vocalist standing at about 5ft tall directly between the two speakers and level with the speakers in depth. 

The Keltiks certainly have a luscious, warm and relaxed feel to them which I'm currently really enjoying whereas my Ninkas are more upfront and snappy. In fact, I plugged my Ninkas back in a couple of days ago. The difference was incredible! The Ninkas sounds so thin in comparison to the Keltiks. They do however sound more open and punchy than the Keltiks. I guess it depends on the sound presentation that you prefer. Like I say, I'm loving the Keltik approach to sound reproduction. Sometimes I'm listening to music and the deep bass kicks in and I have a massive smile on my face! All this evaluation has been done using a 'standard' SO. I certainly haven't felt the need to introduce more bass into a straight Space Optimisation calculation.

What I'm now about to tackle is that of optimum speaker positioning. I have consulted @zee9and he's given great advice on how to conduct the Tune Dem method and I will be experimenting with that over the next few days. It's something that may take a week or two of listening to fine tune. In the end I'm sure it will be worth the effort.

Mike.

Edited by SnapperMike
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Good luck with the tune dem, with the weight of these things it’s not an easy task. I shuffle them a couple cm to and fro from to time, all seems pretty well dialed in at the moment, but I’m not at 100% yet. 

Regarding the recessed vocals; it depends from album to album, sometimes I need to adjust to it and seems to happen when the singer is smaller in a bigger soundstage, if that makes any sense. Sense of scale is also very different the my former M140.

The bass is really something else. I never knew I missed out on that, the M140 go to 55hz passive and aktiv, the Keltiks ad another 35hz and I notice it almost everywhere that vocals, instrument or effects are either “their” or gained more weight/substance. SO is also as calculated in my system. If I learned anything of this experience it’s  that I need at least a 30/40Hz speaker if I ever upgrade. 

I’m really curious if the combination Keltik-AEBi-ASH is easily bettered or not, my best guess is that it won’t be easy or cheap. VFM is great IMHO.

That being said, If one has a enough Exakt-channels this is a must try before you die combo 😎 I saw the same combo popping up in Canada via hifishark today if anybody is interested. 

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47 minutes ago, Pennypacker said:

Good luck with the tune dem, with the weight of these things it’s not an easy task. I shuffle them a couple cm to and fro from to time, all seems pretty well dialed in at the moment, but I’m not at 100% yet. 

Regarding the recessed vocals; it depends from album to album, sometimes I need to adjust to it and seems to happen when the singer is smaller in a bigger soundstage, if that makes any sense. Sense of scale is also very different the my former M140.

The bass is really something else. I never knew I missed out on that, the M140 go to 55hz passive and aktiv, the Keltiks ad another 35hz and I notice it almost everywhere that vocals, instrument or effects are either “their” or gained more weight/substance. SO is also as calculated in my system. If I learned anything of this experience it’s  that I need at least a 30/40Hz speaker if I ever upgrade. 

I’m really curious if the combination Keltik-AEBi-ASH is easily bettered or not, my best guess is that it won’t be easy or cheap. VFM is great IMHO.

That being said, If one has a enough Exakt-channels this is a must try before you die combo 😎 I saw the same combo popping up in Canada via hifishark today if anybody is interested. 

I'm quite sure the Keltik-AEBi-ASH combination can't be beaten cheaply. I'm delighted with my current system. It's the bass that's making it for me too. I don't consider myself a bass-head but the additional bass that the Keltiks bring is very welcome.

When you mention sense of scale, I presume you mean that that the Keltiks have more of that?

Do you have a link to that system in Canada?

Mike.

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16 minutes ago, SnapperMike said:

I'm quite sure the Keltik-AEBi-ASH combination can't be beaten cheaply. I'm delighted with my current system. It's the bass that's making it for me too. I don't consider myself a bass-head but the additional bass that the Keltiks bring is very welcome.

When you mention sense of scale, I presume you mean that that the Keltiks have more of that?

Do you have a link to that system in Canada?

Mike.

@PennypackerI found that Canadian link.

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