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Focal speakers missing serial number


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I don't know whether the op took my advice to call Tony at Coherent, but I sent Tony a message regarding these speakers.  It appears they were Tony's own pair, specially ordered with a  specified x/over which came minus the serial number.  He also informed me they have been sold at least 3 times to various members on forums. Case closed.

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Fair comment Richard, insurance? I had an interesting conversation with insurance co this morning regarding new house insurance and audio content. I’ll do a thread later as it’s very relevant to this

I don't know whether the op took my advice to call Tony at Coherent, but I sent Tony a message regarding these speakers.  It appears they were Tony's own pair, specially ordered with a  specified x/ov

Didn't 'real' Utopias have the SN etched onto the plate where the binding posts are? Either way, any high-ticket speakers with serial numbers missing are a big no-no I would suggest.

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6 hours ago, antonio66 said:

I don't know whether the op took my advice to call Tony at Coherent, but I sent Tony a message regarding these speakers.  It appears they were Tony's own pair, specially ordered with a  specified x/over which came minus the serial number.  He also informed me they have been sold at least 3 times to various members on forums. Case closed.

Just proves that if you do proper research, this is what can come of it. 
sometimes there are legitimate reasons for no serial numbers on products that normally do. 
 

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Rather than a previous owner, the only source of proper attribution would be the manufacturer. Again, I would ask myself why a manufacturer would omit the serial numbers off a product because it was a slightly different specification. If they were supplied new without a serial number, how would the manufacturer identify them and issue an invoice?

More to the point, most potential future buyers are going to be asking the same questions.

Sorry, but my position is unchanged. I don't see 'big ticket' items with no serial numbers as a sensible purchase unless there is supporting documentation from the manufacturer. Anything else is hearsay at best.

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20 minutes ago, rabski said:

Rather than a previous owner, the only source of proper attribution would be the manufacturer. Again, I would ask myself why a manufacturer would omit the serial numbers off a product because it was a slightly different specification. If they were supplied new without a serial number, how would the manufacturer identify them and issue an invoice?

More to the point, most potential future buyers are going to be asking the same questions.

Sorry, but my position is unchanged. I don't see 'big ticket' items with no serial numbers as a sensible purchase unless there is supporting documentation from the manufacturer. Anything else is hearsay at best.

I think your being a bit hard on this occasion Richard when it’s been proven that there is a legitimate answer. The other thing is, the owner is including the original crossovers which are attached to the original back plates and shown in picture and just needs to turn them over to show the serial number.

These crossovers are sealed to the plate so having an upgraded pair sent would be a simple installation but no serial number. Nothing unusual there. 
Ask the right questions and you will get the answers. 

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27 minutes ago, rabski said:

Rather than a previous owner, the only source of proper attribution would be the manufacturer. Again, I would ask myself why a manufacturer would omit the serial numbers off a product because it was a slightly different specification. If they were supplied new without a serial number, how would the manufacturer identify them and issue an invoice?

More to the point, most potential future buyers are going to be asking the same questions.

Sorry, but my position is unchanged. I don't see 'big ticket' items with no serial numbers as a sensible purchase unless there is supporting documentation from the manufacturer. Anything else is hearsay at best.

Yep I agree. If the manufacturer had its act together then its product numbering and serial numbering would accommodate specials like that - how else would they be able to tie it back to the original drawings/spec if it came back for repair?

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3 minutes ago, Tony_J said:

Yep I agree. If the manufacturer had its act together then its product numbering and serial numbering would accommodate specials like that - how else would they be able to tie it back to the original drawings/spec if it came back for repair?

I’ve answered that, it was a Utopia upgrade kit. 

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4 minutes ago, radiant red said:

I’ve answered that, it was a Utopia upgrade kit. 

My comment still applies.

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8 minutes ago, radiant red said:

I think your being a bit hard on this occasion Richard when it’s been proven that there is a legitimate answer. The other thing is, the owner is including the original crossovers which are attached to the original back plates and shown in picture and just needs to turn them over to show the serial number.

These crossovers are sealed to the plate so having an upgraded pair sent would be a simple installation but no serial number. Nothing unusual there. 
Ask the right questions and you will get the answers. 

I'm not being hard, I'm being sensible and pragmatic.

Unfortunately, I've learned the hard way in the past as to what is considered 'proof' of something, and what isn't.

I'm not saying that the explanation is not correct, and I'm certainly not suggesting anything underhand with regard to the dealer here. What I am saying, however, is that without something in writing from the manufacturer, what you have is 'a story'. It is in no way 'proof' of anything at all.

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10 minutes ago, rabski said:

I'm not being hard, I'm being sensible and pragmatic.

Unfortunately, I've learned the hard way in the past as to what is considered 'proof' of something, and what isn't.

I'm not saying that the explanation is not correct, and I'm certainly not suggesting anything underhand with regard to the dealer here. What I am saying, however, is that without something in writing from the manufacturer, what you have is 'a story'. It is in no way 'proof' of anything at all.

But you don’t know that? You haven’t asked the question so to dismiss without all the facts is foolish. How do you know their isn’t an upgrade invoice in the box? In 2011, these upgrade crossovers with back plate were available to dealers. I know someone who worked in a dealership in Cambridge that did these. 
simply get all the facts and then make a decision. This hasn’t been done on this thread and conclusions are being met. 
Being ‘sensible’ means find out the facts first. 
Come on Richard, you know that’s the right answer regardless of the decision to purchase.

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17 minutes ago, radiant red said:

But you don’t know that? You haven’t asked the question so to dismiss without all the facts is foolish. How do you know their isn’t an upgrade invoice in the box? In 2011, these upgrade crossovers with back plate were available to dealers. I know someone who worked in a dealership in Cambridge that did these. 
simply get all the facts and then make a decision. This hasn’t been done on this thread and conclusions are being met. 
Being ‘sensible’ means find out the facts first. 
Come on Richard, you know that’s the right answer regardless of the decision to purchase.

You're actually reinforcing my point. Which is quite simple and basic. People saying 'I know that...', and 'he said that...' is not proof of anything at all. The problem comes some time down the line when either a prospective buyer is 'fussy' or there is some issue and someone actually does need to prove something.

Try claiming off your home insurance and telling them the thing you're claining for didn't have the serial number that the insurer is asking for. Think they'll be happy with the suggestion that the person who once owned them told you it was OK?

I appreciate that I'm overly cynical. However, that way I don't get caught too often.

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Quite apart from the serial number shenanigans, the overriding reason to reject them is that they will strip the enamel from your teeth, shurely?

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2 minutes ago, rabski said:

You're actually reinforcing my point. Which is quite simple and basic. People saying 'I know that...', and 'he said that...' is not proof of anything at all. The problem comes some time down the line when either a prospective buyer is 'fussy' or there is some issue and someone actually does need to prove something.

Try claiming off your home insurance and telling them the thing you're claining for didn't have the serial number that the insurer is asking for. Think they'll be happy with the suggestion that the person who once owned them told you it was OK?

I appreciate that I'm overly cynical. However, that way I don't get caught too often.

Fair comment Richard, insurance? I had an interesting conversation with insurance co this morning regarding new house insurance and audio content. I’ll do a thread later as it’s very relevant to this hobby 👍🏻

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5 hours ago, Blzebub said:

Quite apart from the serial number shenanigans, the overriding reason to reject them is that they will strip the enamel from your teeth, shurely?

Why would they do that, hope you're not thinking of the replacement model, with Be tweeters.  My brother had a pair of Mezzo's from that era, ok they never lacked for detail, but stripping the enamel from your teeth, I don't think so.

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I knew you were joking, the reputation came from the Be tweeter I think, which many found 'bright', but I'm led to believe choosing the right equipment, and of course getting used to more information coming through they are excellent speakers.

Let's not forget, 'shouldn't be partnered with Naim'  xD

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