Alternative/DIY soutions for speaker isolation.

vacdac

Wammer
Wammer
Jul 19, 2011
11,536
278
143
Manchester
AKA
Chris
HiFi Trade?
  1. No
I have a single Adam F7 active monitor arriving tomorrow alongside a Topping TP60 from Jerry.

It is going to be located in the same spot as the previous M.A. RS LCR in the foot well of a heavy oak desk that is a fully enclosed very solid construction with three drawers top to bottom each side. Acoustically speaking I don't think the new speaker is going to cause too many problems I can't overcome as it is an even more solid construction than the rear ported RS LCR. As the F7 is front ported it should work even better than the LCR, which I'll admit has actually been a greater success oriented vertically in t' knee cubby than I ever envisaged*. (*I was forced to adopt this strategy as the place atop the desk it previously occupied under the centrally mounted TV, is the only sensible place for my hot running XTZ power amp)

Anyhoo the F7 is effectively going to be in the throat of a larger box & that is summat I'm stuck with. What has concerned me a little is resonance control of the lower registers, as t' F7's will be far more capable lower down than the M.A.'s.

Anyhoo, here's what I've come up with so far based on ideas gained from my Adam F5's I use in the second system. These are also furniture mounted by necessity on a 6' wide heavy chest of drawers in an alcove. For these I've cut some 2 core high density foam camping mat to size to fit some heavy granite trivet stands that are near perfect in size as speaker bases. I use two layers between speaker & granite & a further layer underneath. This has proved extremely effective & is a clear improvement, even the compromised alcove location has been summat the F5's:love: :love: have seemed to shrug off & they're also extremely stable.

For the F7 I'm trying summat similar. This time though I'm using granite place mats whose width is perfect although the depth is a little longer than needed & they are only around half the height of the trivets @ around 6/7mm. Same idea then but a bit different, partly based on the extra weight/stability of the F7 I've decided to use a double layer foam/granite/d.l foam/granite /d.l. foam construction. So I've got my six layers of foam cut neatly to size & even without the weight of the speaker on it this actually already feels both solid & stable.

Any drawbacks that anyone is can think of to this approach? I had been considering some of the stick on acoustifeet from Paul @ PuriteNorth, as I'll prolly be ordering one or two of the Spikey mains thangs he's selling & may need some of the feet fer a couple of other things too.

I'd generally prefer not to be sticking owt onto the underside of the speaker cabs if I can help it TBPH. One advantage**(**lol likely miniscule) is that the multi layered platform I've created is going to raise the tweeter up a further 3" & effectively the new tweeter height is going to be prolly about 5" higher than the previous M.A. despite its taller stature*** (*** centrally located metal dome on RS LCR)

My own experience with the ribbon tweeters on both the XTZ main speakers & the Adam F5's in t'other room is that subjectively speaking the dispersal characteristics seem very good & IMV far superior to the previous MA RS8's + the LCR front, although the switchable dipole/bipole rears are v good & will remain.

I'm hoping to reintroduce SACD at some point next year & may even take this further, depending on how good the integration is with the XTZ main speakers.....If it's good I'll leave as is......obviously. If however it seems promising but obviously lacking in cohesiveness across the front three channels I may explore adding a further pair of F7's & possibly a sub or two. :geek:

I have in room EQ options for all 3 front speakers, although the adjustment for the XTZ's is limited to 4 steps for both bass & treble individually. However the myriad of different port tuning options does vastly increase the range of in room tuning options for these speakers. Given this I'm hoping for good integration as the ribbon tweeter of the F7 is hopefully a better match. :upgrade:

 

awkwardbydesign

Perfect, apparently.
Wammer
Mar 5, 2012
10,241
1,930
173
HiFi Trade?
  1. No
Inner tubes. As in the original Seismic Sinks. DIYable and very effective.

 

vacdac

Wammer
Wammer
Jul 19, 2011
11,536
278
143
Manchester
AKA
Chris
HiFi Trade?
  1. No
Inner tubes. As in the original Seismic Sinks. DIYable and very effective.
Cheers Dick,

Yeah this is akshurrly summat I've considered in the past & I'm aware of your self builds using this idea. :^

Any thoughts on what I've done so far & whether this may be fairly effective?

Obviously, for now I've simply gone with stuff readily to hand in the house, encouraged by a similar implementation working well in the bedroom. I already have a comparison point from using the previous MA RS LCR centre speaker which wasn't at all problematic in this respect. The Desk is solid oak & a double thickness/layered construction in many places & must weigh in excess of 200 pounds. It is not prone to being excited by in room resonances. the Desk is mounted on heavy screwed feet with glider cups that are easy to level & allow it to be moved forward for cabling access.

If this does seem to work well I will prolly just stick with it TBH. But I'm always open to alternative approaches, particularly if DIY which is by far my preference as I like to try stuff out TBH. Even really simple solutions to issues that occur, often give me far greater satisfaction than being forced to buy an off the shelf solution. If my Heath Robinson idea is ineffective, the inner tube 'a la Townsend idea may be one I end up pursuing.

Thanks Mate...I value your input on this kinda stuff as I know you've put a lot of thought into room treatment & reasonance control & have admired your efforts posted here. Always great to see a bit of 'can do' type stuff here too!!

ATB

C.

 

awkwardbydesign

Perfect, apparently.
Wammer
Mar 5, 2012
10,241
1,930
173
HiFi Trade?
  1. No
Hard to viualise exactly what you have done, but often using mass changes the frequency of vibrations. I think you have 3 choices; isolate (seismic sinks, etc), absorb (eg.Sorbothane) or transmit (spikes, etc).

If you transmit (couple) then you need the vibration to go somewhere it won't cause problems, that is "sink" it. A wood desk MAY not be the ideal sink.

If you absorb then you need something either tuned to the problem or sufficiently broadband.

If you isolate, then the vibrations will stay in the original item.

Spikes mainly transmit, but I think they can be narrow band transmitters depending on design, and anything not transmitted has to be absorbed at source.

I am lucky, my floor is solid concrete with a solid oak layer glued down; I deliberately chose the type of floor. So spikes can work ok, but as I make massive and well braced speakers, seismic sink isolation is even better. Again, they need to be tuned to about 2Hz.

If you can absorb, that would be best IMO, but it's harder than the other methods I think.

Good luck, and experiment, you may get lucky with diferent methods comlementing each other. Or not!

 

vacdac

Wammer
Wammer
Jul 19, 2011
11,536
278
143
Manchester
AKA
Chris
HiFi Trade?
  1. No
I'll get back with some more thoughts tomozzzah prolly Dick. :^

For now tho' I've added a further place mat & another single layer of foam mat* (*So thats four place mats & seven layers of cut foam in total). Just because I could TBH. :)

The Adam F7 is a chunky little brute at 9kg for its rather squat dimensions, the fit to the place mats is perfect width wise & there is roughly 3cm of the mats projecting back from the rear face of the speaker. As this can't be seen it's pretty ideal TBH. Even at moderately high volumes the floor of the foot well basically feels pretty inert & this already feels a success as I seem to have got what I was aiming for. :cool:

I've also ordered several sets of acoustifeet from Paul @ PuriteNorth last night, so I'll have a play with these too.

Also at some point this W/End I'll put all the new kit through it's paces properly & fine tune from there. For now I've got all the levels set properly, which was the only vaguely techy bit of t' process & took all of around 3 mins as all the distances are the same as before. :geek:

The next stage will be reinstating 2ch + multi channel SACD capabilities, which I've been without for some time...A C.A. 752BD is looking the choice pick for me at the mo' , but is not penned in until next spring as I have a more pressing need to update the tellybox first + the winter months are when I tend to have a proper splurge on nooooo toooooooonz. :rockin: :stereo:

ATB

C.

ATB

C.

 

vacdac

Wammer
Wammer
Jul 19, 2011
11,536
278
143
Manchester
AKA
Chris
HiFi Trade?
  1. No
I have used springs successfully under floor standing speakers.
Interesting Tom. Are these coil springs then? How have you implemented this? I'm presuming they would be hefty buggers. :)

 

awkwardbydesign

Perfect, apparently.
Wammer
Mar 5, 2012
10,241
1,930
173
HiFi Trade?
  1. No
Current Seismic stands are springs with air damping. That is a bellows type sleeve with a small hole to allow some air to escape, I believe. Again tuned to about 2-3Hz. Finding the correct bellows and calculating the spring tuning is a job for someone with better computer skills than I have.

BTW, inner tube platforms under amps etc. need a softer setting than speakers. I found it harder to get right. Different tubes (cheap were best), and different pressures.

 

awkwardbydesign

Perfect, apparently.
Wammer
Mar 5, 2012
10,241
1,930
173
HiFi Trade?
  1. No
I would like to do the spring+air method, but indeed pricey. The advantage of inner tubes is that it is possible to tune by changing the pressure. Cheap! And I use two, separated by a divider, so I can level the speakers. With the later ones I didn't bother with the routing, just two rectangular chambers and 14" tubes.



 

awkwardbydesign

Perfect, apparently.
Wammer
Mar 5, 2012
10,241
1,930
173
HiFi Trade?
  1. No
It was too stiff for the equipment rack. I now use granite shelves hanging on rope supports, like a hammock. I like a bit of rope.

 

tuga

. . .
Wammer
Aug 17, 2007
12,723
5,179
173
Oxfordshire, UK
AKA
Ric
HiFi Trade?
  1. No
Got one of the small ones at the supermaket for 2 or 3€ a while ago and sliced it into 8 pieces:

14wcbar.jpg


Does the job…ugly colour, though.

R

 

Forum statistics

Threads
110,224
Messages
2,341,410
Members
69,660
Latest member
Guitarlegs

Latest Articles

Staff online