Floor Standing Speakers vs Stand Mount

The_Krell

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I thought we should have a seperate thread from "breaking into the high end with speakers.."

I think the most significant effect on deep bass is the room, not whether its a floor stander or stand mounted speaker.

.. but imagine if the vertical elements of the enclosure were extended down to the floor, with perhaps a second 8" driver (or whatever the designer found best), surely its bass would be even better - perhaps recovering much of that lost lowest octave. This would create an even better looking speaker and save the $3600 stand cost. Put this towards the taller encloseure and additional driver and I doubt they'd be out of pocket! Peter

Which is a huge extra lot of design work. Extra bracing, more structural rigidity required more cost, having to source the right driver, crossover etc. Not as simple as one would hope. And of course all the extra costs then get multiplied up for us the consumer. And from a product placement perspective - just looking at cost - the company may have wanted to sell a speaker in the £3000 segment but are now trying to sell a £4000 one. Not to mention more expensive so less units sold = higher margin so even more expensive.

Designing a stand is a relatively cheaper option.
 

pmcuk

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I often wonder about cutting a round hole in the bottom of a stand mount speaker and fitting a pipe there of some kind. Should be a simple experiment with a cheap pair of bookshelf speakers. The pipe could even be one size pipe inside another with sand in between. So instead of just a stand, you would increase the internal volume. You would then re-design the port or just fill it in for a sealed box.
 
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tackleberry

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We all have an opinion on how a stand/floor stander sounds.

Most people say with a FS “yeah decent bass”

Then you stick a SM in front of them and they say “wow, they do bass for their size!”

It’s knowing what to look for, because there is quite a difference in the right room for both options.
 

hearhere

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I thought we should have a seperate thread from "breaking into the high end with speakers.."

I think the most significant effect on deep bass is the room, not whether its a floor stander or stand mounted speaker.



Which is a huge extra lot of design work. Extra bracing, more structural rigidity required more cost, having to source the right driver, crossover etc. Not as simple as one would hope. And of course all the extra costs then get multiplied up for us the consumer. And from a product placement perspective - just looking at cost - the company may have wanted to sell a speaker in the £3000 segment but are now trying to sell a £4000 one. Not to mention more expensive so less units sold = higher margin so even more expensive.

Designing a stand is a relatively cheaper option.
In the case I was mentioing, the stand alone was priced at $3600 when reviewd 10 years ago. The extra cost in enclosure construction (deeper side, front and back panels plus internal bracing, etc) and one extra driver may not be much more than the cost of the stand. The design cost, if this floor-stander was an alternative to the stand-mount, would be much the same as the stand-mount, but if it was an additional product, much of the work is already done and the extra cost would not be overwhelming. Obviously the maker would like to ask a higher price for the bigger speakers, but that needn't be out of proportion.

My point really is - why do some many people choose stand-mounts with their (generally speaking) less attractive looks, their costly stands and (again generally speaking) their less good bass, when they could buy a nicer looking floor-stander that takes up no more floor space and looks and sounds better - for little extra outlay? And then, after a while the owner realises his bass is not as generaous as he'd hoped for, so starts thinking of adding a sub or two!

PS - Krell - there's a problem with creating a new topic just because the original subject has diverted a bit - readers of the new topic don't understand the point of the initial posting, particularly if it's a quote from another thread!
 

The_Krell

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My point really is - why do some many people choose stand-mounts with their (generally speaking) less attractive looks, their costly stands and (again generally speaking) their less good bass, when they could buy a nicer looking floor-stander that takes up no more floor space and looks and sounds better - for little extra outlay? And then, after a while the owner realises his bass is not as generaous as he'd hoped for, so starts thinking of adding a sub or two!

PS - Krell - there's a problem with creating a new topic just because the original subject has diverted a bit - readers of the new topic don't understand the point of the initial posting, particularly if it's a quote from another thread!
Being the in the above group....because they were the best sounding LS (for the money) I heard at the time I bought them. The floor standers I wanted were a huge step up in money outlay so I went with the stand mounts (the stands were inclusive of purchase price).
I always had it in the back of my mind that I would change them for floor speakers at some point and then disapointingly "life" intervened and so I didn't. So this year I bought a sub instead.
I didn't have any hopes for the bass with the speakers so it was never a disapointment.
From an aesthetic side I've never been bothered how something looks if it sounds good so stands weren't a problem for me.

ps - thanks the tip :)
 

DomT

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In the case I was mentioing, the stand alone was priced at $3600 when reviewd 10 years ago. The extra cost in enclosure construction (deeper side, front and back panels plus internal bracing, etc) and one extra driver may not be much more than the cost of the stand. The design cost, if this floor-stander was an alternative to the stand-mount, would be much the same as the stand-mount, but if it was an additional product, much of the work is already done and the extra cost would not be overwhelming. Obviously the maker would like to ask a higher price for the bigger speakers, but that needn't be out of proportion.

My point really is - why do some many people choose stand-mounts with their (generally speaking) less attractive looks, their costly stands and (again generally speaking) their less good bass, when they could buy a nicer looking floor-stander that takes up no more floor space and looks and sounds better - for little extra outlay? And then, after a while the owner realises his bass is not as generaous as he'd hoped for, so starts thinking of adding a sub or two!

PS - Krell - there's a problem with creating a new topic just because the original subject has diverted a bit - readers of the new topic don't understand the point of the initial posting, particularly if it's a quote from another thread!
Some stand mounts work better in certain rooms. And some manufacturers such as Harbeth don’t do floorstanders. I like some floorstanders but haven’t heard that many that were ‘better’ overall than stand mount. I have only ever owned two pairs of floor standers despite trying to buy more but they have always lost out. In many systems the floor standers that I have heard the bass was often the problem.
 

tackleberry

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Some stand mounts work better in certain rooms. And some manufacturers such as Harbeth don’t do floorstanders. I like some floorstanders but haven’t heard that many that were ‘better’ overall than stand mount. I have only ever owned two pairs of floor standers despite trying to buy more but they have always lost out. In many systems the floor standers that I have heard the bass was often the problem.
That’s why I went for large actives in the end, it was a revelation.

I have a big room, but the listening position only uses half of it. The listening position is slightly bass light on the room mode, which I’m glad, even lucky with as there is no booming. The thing you do notice though is when a speaker isn’t performing in the bass department, It’s like a litmus test , particularly with ported floorstanders. They can sound flabby and for want of a better word inaccurate.
 
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sktn77a

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If you have the room, floorstanders. Otherwise, bookshelves.
Bookshelf speakers on stands..... why not just get floorstanders???
 
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Music At Home

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Don’t forget “Hoffman’s Iron Law” of loudspeakers. You can only have any two of the following:

- Small Size
- High Sensitivity
- Deep Bass

If you want small speakers, you’ll have to give up high sensitivity (powerful amp needed) or deep bass. If you want deep bass, you’ll have to give up small size (floor standers needed) or high sensitivity.
 

MartinC

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One of the advantages with standmounts is you can get the tweeter at the exact height you want .especially if you make your own stands
I've done this with my floorstanding speakers by placing them on little platforms to raise them up. 'Floorstanders' don't have to literally sit on the floor.

As well as bass extension I think one key factor in the standmount vs floorstanding choice is how loud you want the speakers to play (which in speaker output terms is also related to room size).

I don't personally buy the argument of floorstanding speakers always looking better though. On aesthetic grounds I'd rather have standmounts as they'd be less visually imposing.
 

StingRay

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Stands dont have to be expensive either, mine were about £40. You can get some decent stands for around £100 or less. Floorstanders in small rooms don't often work without room treatment. I have demoed floorstanders and did not like them and they resonated even at modest volume with double bass. FS are often around double the price of SM equivalent.
 
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m7rso

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I dont think this will be a fair fight to be honest. But if we are going to make them fight, lets video It!
 

MartinC

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As @Rockchild says there is definitely no universal 'best for everyone' answer.

Three more thoughts on the general subject:

  1. Standmounts used in combination with one or more subwoofers can be a very good option that doesn't exactly fit in either camp.
  2. You can get some very big standmount speakers and very small floorstanding speakers which rather muddy the distinction.
  3. Kii Three are extremely capable standmount speakers and yet they still make their BXT bass modules to go with them.
kii-audio-firmenbericht-12.jpg
 

mj446

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If you have the room, floorstanders. Otherwise, bookshelves.
Bookshelf speakers on stands..... why not just get floorstanders???
I have this discussion? with my wife, she won't have floor standers in the house but is happy with standmount and the stands around, they take up the same square footage in the room? Woman's logic I suppose and i'll have to live with it, or change the wife before the next speakers?
Although my standmounts are a bit bigger than bookshelf, I don't own any books that size.
 

MartinC

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I have this discussion? with my wife, she won't have floor standers in the house but is happy with standmount and the stands around, they take up the same square footage in the room? Woman's logic I suppose and i'll have to live with it, or change the wife before the next speakers?
Although my standmounts are a bit bigger than bookshelf, I don't own any books that size.
It's not just about footprint though. I think standmounts are generally less visually imposing since the stands themselves are usually much narrower than the bottom part of a floorstanding speaker. You can see through more of the space that would be blocked by a floorstanding speaker when using standmounts.

Consider this photo recently posted by @Jezzer for example:

75d8c85e-5d34-43a2-ac96-4ec440dd606c-jpeg.98718


Or this:

E-GtUJgXsAApQ7D.jpg


I use floorstanding speakers but purely aesthetically I'd prefer to use standmounts for this reason. This is grumpy middle-aged man 'logic' rather than 'woman's logic' mind, and I wouldn't remotely presume to share any insight on the latter!
 

Lawrence001

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Don’t forget “Hoffman’s Iron Law” of loudspeakers. You can only have any two of the following:

- Small Size
- High Sensitivity
- Deep Bass

If you want small speakers, you’ll have to give up high sensitivity (powerful amp needed) or deep bass. If you want deep bass, you’ll have to give up small size (floor standers needed) or high sensitivity.
It's a good general rule but misses 2 factors, SPL limit and "one note" bass. If you need to play loud then extra drivers help, although strictly speaking the rule is about the same drivers in different sized cabinets.

Some have said on here that one note bass is a fallacy, I'm sure it's not. You can make a small speaker measure down to 40Hz sine wave, but the texture of a bass instrument or reverberation in a hall will be absent or unnatural at best.
 
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