Loud speaker advice needed for small listening room.

Henk

Wammer
New Wammer
Nov 28, 2013
29
0
0
Herefordshire
Hi all,

I have recently moved to a smaller property with smaller rooms. I am fortunate to have a dedicated listening room.

Dimensions are 7' 10" (2.38) wide X 12' (3.6 m) length X 7' (2.13 m) high. The backs of the speakers are positioned 22" (0.56 m) from window/wall and 14" (0.35 m) from side walls. My listening position is 8ft (2.43 m) away.

My speakers are Avalon Ascendants floor standers, which are truly stunning and not too large & in the past have always sounded sublime. However in this room they sound hughly powerful with an almost overwhelming amount of detail. The mid & high frequencies sound unforgiving and relentless. I find I am having to constantly turn the volume down when I get to loud passages on a given piece of music. The over all effect is very fatiqueing.

Is it a case of the law of physics i.e. too powerful a speaker in too small a space? Maybe I need to reluctantly look at other speakers which would more suite the room for example Standmounts or a smaller Floorstanders, which work well nearer back & side walls.

Any advice would be appreciated.



 

It Cost How Much!?!

Twisted
Wammer
Oct 27, 2008
16,912
1,536
173
Hartford, Cheshire
AKA
Bob
HiFi Trade?
  1. No
As you have put this in the bake-off and show section, how about having a few wammers around and get them to bring some speakers.

My advice would be Focal 1007Be if you listen loud or Harbeth HL-P3ESR (snappy name) if you don't.

 

pure sound

Wammer
Wammer
Sep 10, 2011
8,771
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108
West Devon
HiFi Trade?
  1. No
You might be getting an awful lot of reflected sound from the side walls & ceiling in what is a relatively narrow room. I'd look at ensuring that at least the 1st reflection points (ie those places on the side walls where if you placed a mirror you'd be able to see the speakers) are covered with something absorbent. Ditto for the ceiling if you can arrange it.

 

HoopsOnToast

Legend Wammer
Wammer
Feb 6, 2006
11,802
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Oxfordshire
AKA
Rob
HiFi Trade?
  1. Yes
For a small room like that I would look into some mini-monitors such as the ATC SCM7 / SCM10 or Spendor S3/5R and SA1 for example.

 

paulf-2007

Wammer
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Jun 18, 2008
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souf east for work
HiFi Trade?
  1. No
I also have a dedicated listening room 3 metres by 3 metres tapering to 2.5 metres at the seating end. I have 200hz tractrix horns and 15" open baffle bass and ribbons. I listen at 75-85db. It has a raised wood floor with carpet tiles and plasterboard stud walls with 40mm acoustic insulation. Why do you think it sounds as good as it did in my larger room with solid floor and walls. I have heard other horn systems and box speakers at various locations and have not heard anything better.

 

Chumpy

Wammer
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Dec 3, 2005
14,084
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Bristol UK
AKA
Charlie
HiFi Trade?
  1. No
Yes.

Depending on your new environment/flooring/walling/ceiling-roofing, position what you like correctly/be easy on the potentiometer-etc control.

Do not get rid of what you like, or you will vainly seek it later when elsewhere.

 

Tenson

Wammer
Wammer
Mar 2, 2006
407
2
0
You don't need to change your speakers. You need to treat your room. Read up on room acoustics (first reflections, room modes, quadratic diffusors, reverb time). Invest in some absorbent panels and bass traps etc..

 

brystonian

Wammer
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Aug 23, 2012
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Jim
HiFi Trade?
  1. No
:goodone: My old listening room was of a similar size. Acoustic treatments made a huge difference to the sound.

A decent size trap straddling the corners and something covering the first reflections should help a lot. Maybe a couple of traps behind your head as you're quite close to the back wall.

Having said that my old PMC DB1i's interacted with the room less than any other speaker I've had.

The PMC Twenty series stand mounts might be better for you though as they are front ported.

 

Tenson

Wammer
Wammer
Mar 2, 2006
407
2
0
If you do change speakers, you might consider some MEG speakers with the 'K' post-fix. This means they have a cardioid radiation pattern that interferes less with the room. Di-poles can also work well where other speakers don't, so that means ESLs or perhaps some Jammo open-baffles.

 
M

Mike P

Guest
A combination of the advice above really. The speakers are almost certainly too large for the room unfortunately. I was in a similar position when we moved to the current house. I had a pair of Sonus Faber Amati Anniversarios which worked brilliantly in a room 14' x 28' but in the old house but just wouldn't work at all in the current room which is 12' x 14'.

I treated the room, adding some GIK panels, added a large rug to the wooden floor and downsized the speakers to something better suited to the room. The results are excellent and I'm very happy. Yes, the room treatments helped a lot but the speakers had to go; there is no way the Amatis would have worked in the room even once the room was treated. I'm sure you will need to change the speakers to achieve a sensible result.

 

Henk

Wammer
New Wammer
Nov 28, 2013
29
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Herefordshire
Many thanks for the advice, much appreciated.

I will try treating the room & if that does not work, sadly will have to let the Ascendants go for something smaller.

 

Micke Y

Wammer
Wammer
Jun 8, 2006
518
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Stockholm, , Sweden
I my view speaker size is no problem at all if you can treat the room and control reverberation time in the bass - meaning bass absorbers. I have a small dedicated room and huge, bass rich speakers with no problems. Looks are bad but sound is wonderful.

I also have two subs



Michael

 

nick dartmoor

Super Wammer Plus
Wammer
Sep 19, 2009
1,633
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Devon, UK
Definitely try acoustic treatment first, because it may well work, and even if ultimately you do wind up having to change the speakers, the treatment will certainly have improved things, so the next speakers will sound better anyway.

As well as the obvious rock-wool panels, it might be worth considering kilo-serge drapes, which you can get in various colours to suit.

 

Plutospeakers

Wammer
New Wammer
Nov 12, 2013
23
0
0
Newark-on-Trent
AKA
Xiang
Speaker size vs room size cerainly affects the depth and image of the sound. All loudspeakers need space to breath unless the listener is happy with a flat and forward sound. My feeling is that a small space need good absorption on all surface <0.5m to the loudspeakers and diffusion on the back of the loudspeakers. Sorry only feeling and you will need lot of trial and error works and the sweet spot will be very restrict.

 

leenorris78

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Jun 1, 2009
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London - SE23 -HOP
AKA
Lee
HiFi Trade?
  1. Yes
I came across this website a while back

http://ethanwiner.com/acoustics.html

Could be some use?

As I understand, if the right acoustical treatment is in place, you can have pretty much any speaker in any room. Its just most people don't want to go down the acoustic treatment route, like myself. But if you have a dedicated room and a few quid………………..……... :cool:

 

Tenson

Wammer
Wammer
Mar 2, 2006
407
2
0
If you combine acoustic treatments with digital correction (digital EQ) you really can use any speaker in any room and get great results. Well.. as long as the system is actually good! Usually, what acoustic treatments can't cure, digital correction can tidy up nicely.

I've used speakers with 2x 12" woofers per side and 1500watts per channel in a room 2.2m x 2.4m. Anything is possible ;)

 

paulf-2007

Wammer
Wammer
Jun 18, 2008
4,422
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93
souf east for work
HiFi Trade?
  1. No
Speaker size vs room size cerainly affects the depth and image of the sound. All loudspeakers need space to breath unless the listener is happy with a flat and forward sound. My feeling is that a small space need good absorption on all surface <0.5m to the loudspeakers and diffusion on the back of the loudspeakers. Sorry only feeling and you will need lot of trial and error works and the sweet spot will be very restrict.
Sweet spot? In a 9 square metre room it's difficult not to be in the sweet spot

 

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