SOLD Primaluna Dialogue Premium Pre / Premium HP Power Amps

[Jules_S]

If ever there was a hard lesson learned about system matching and auditioning, this is it! Some people will know the story here already but for those who don't, the short version is that I rashly sold my previous amp to part-fund these amps, thinking that the pairing with my Martin Logans would resolve the slight shortcomings that bothered me. Unfortunately, my gamble has not paid off, the power amp being unhappy with the rather vicious impedance curve swings of the Summit ESLs. And so I am selling these again after only a month of ownership, to look for a replacement that better suits the demanding load of the MLs. Don't take the short tenure as any failing on the part of the amps, only of the dimwit owner who should have done his homework better before purchase!

So.... make the most of my stupidity and grab what is, with any "sensible, real-world" speaker, an absolute knock-out pairing of the Primaluna Dialogue Premium pre and matching Premium HP power amp. There's a few very happy owners of PL on this forum and with good reason, it's beautifully designed, built to a high standard, and of course sounds brilliant. I recently took these to another bake-off where I was able to use them with a high quality but far more forgiving speaker and they shone.

The pre-amp features 5 source inputs plus a dedicated home theatre input that bypasses the pre altogether, acting simply as a pass-through function for AV amps. There is a tape-out connection and 2 pairs of stereo out. he amp is completely single-ended, no balanced ins or outs.

The power amp has 4, 8 and 16 ohm taps to work with speakers as appropriate. The amp is bridgeable and therefore can be used as a mono in pairing with a second Dialogue power amp, and this alters the taps to 2, 4 and 8 ohm respectively.

The amps are particularly flexible when it comes to choice of tubes - they are designed to work with a variety of both small signal and output valves, and Primaluna all but encourage the owner to try out different ones to find the "flavour" that works for them. The handbooks give the following advice for the pre:

• 5AR4 can be substituted for GZ34, CV1377, or 5V4G, 5T4, and 5Y3 with some sonic changes
• 12AU7 can be substituted for : ECC82, ECC802S, E82CC, 5814, 6189, CV4003

The power amp is even more flexible. It can be operated in ultralinear or triode modes simply by pressing a button on the remote control (the pre-amp remote has the same feature so the power amp's "wand" is a bit redundant). It also features full autobiasing together with a switch on the side of the chassis that allows you to choose between the KT range of valves and EL34s and variants. These types are listed as OK:

• KT88, KT90, KT120, KT150 and 6550
• EL34, E34L, E34LS, 6CA7, or the following valves with a drop in power - 6L6GC, 7581A, KT66

My particular pair is fitted with the following valve compliment:

Pre-Amp

• 2 x Primaluna-branded 5AR4 rectifier
• 6 x Tung-Sol 12AU7

Power Amp

• 6 x Tung-Sol 12AU7
• 8 x Tung-Sol KT120

All the small signal tubes have dampers fitted by the previous owner.

The overall condition of the amps is excellent - in the interests of complete transparency I need to point out the following cosmetic blemishes (I bought these amps unseen so was not aware of any of them until I unboxed them at home, but they are minor):

• On the pre there are signs of rubbing, a tiny chip and a hairline scratch on the transformer cover, behind the valve cage. With the cage fitted it's completely invisible, I only noticed when I took it off to dust it
• The top edge of the fascia has obviously taken a knock by the previous owner and has been touched in. It's all but unnoticeable unless you get up close when you can see a slight difference in colour. The front face is not damaged and from a normal listening position you'd not see it
• There is a pin-head sized chip in the paint on the inner edge of one of the rear valve bases

I've not seen any other cosmetic issues apart from that, and from a functional perspective they are 100% working as intended. Caveat: I've not tested the home theatre bypass function but can't see any reason why that wouldn't be working.

Both amps come in their original double-boxed packaging with instructions, spare slo-blo fuses as supplied by Primaluna, and fully working remote controls. They're pretty weighty and bulky in the boxes.

Given that they don't work well with my Martin Logans I would hesitate to offer a home demo here as you won't be hearing them at their best. However, I would be more than happy if you wished to bring your own speakers along to try out. Alternatively, I would be happy to bring them to you for a demo at your own home, within a "reasonable" distance of Southampton - Hampshire, Dorset, Sussex, Wiltshire, Berkshire, that sort of area. Further afield might be possible with the help of a Wam taxi.

I have taken plenty of photos including the cosmetic issues, more than I can publish here, but happy to forward them on request.

I'm looking for £3200 for the pair, £3000 for the pair, delivered anywhere within the sort of radius mentioned above. Not looking to split them. If you have any other questions or need more info please PM me and I'll be happy to help any way I can.













Here they are at Ian's recent bake-off, driving a pair of WAD KLS9 speakers:

 

[Non-Smoking Man]

These Prima Lunas went well at Baggawire's recent bake off and I and the others can testify they are in full working condition, plus they look and sound very good.
They are boxed and ready to rock.
At present I dont have a huge lot of kit to take up North in my next Wam Taxi compared with a fullish car coming back, so, if booked in now, have a guaranteed spot in the Mondeo estate on July 1st.
(I will be following a route from W. Sussex to Selby in W. Yorkshire with deviations for drop-offs.)
Those are my WAD KLS9s in Jules pic and the system sounded top notch to our ears.

Jack

 

[Jules_S]

Quick bump and a little update -

I've spoken with Herman at Primaluna and he has confirmed a manufacture date of 2014/15 for these amps. I don't have an exact date.

I am hoping to have a replacement front fascia for the Dialogue Premium pre to replace the slightly damaged one. Photo below shows the current fascia so you can see what it looks like. If you check out the top picture above you'll see that it's barely noticeable from the front, only from above. On the photo below if you look directly down from the fourth 12AU7 from the left to the very front edge of the fascia, you'll make out the area of concern.

The only question at the moment is the timing as the fascia is coming directly from Primaluna, and Herman has warned me it may be a month or so until they can send it so it may not have arrived prior to sale. Should that happen then of course I will forward it on to the new owner as soon as possible. If it arrives before sale then it will ship with the amp.

Also, having noticed that one of the rubber valve cage grommets has perished I have arranged for a replacement for that as well.

These really are superb amps. well worthy of their positive owner feedback and glowing reviews, as long as you don't try running them with ESLs!

BTW should point out the photo below was taken when I first unboxed them so they hadn't been dusted and cleaned!

 

[fordy]

How did they compare to the WAD (6550?) amp in the foreground?

 

[Jules_S]

At the risk of giving a rather non-commital sort of response, I think that the results split the room, some preferring one over the other. Probably no surprise to hear that - this is hi-fi after all! The PL has a LOT of grunt, which is no surprise given its running 4 x KT120s per channel so it's a muscular sound with lots of drive. With the material we played at the bake-off (which was basically the same three tracks over, Jazz, so not my bag either really if I'm honest) it probably didn't bring out the best of the amp, which would be very much suited to rock, blues, pop etc. The WAD had a smidgen more detail and "air". Maybe with different material the results would have changed.

As always, one can only trust one's own ears ultimately, but these are not weedy and delicate things! That said they give excellent insight into the music and deliver an involving and enjoyable performance

 

[GLB]

Dont forget speakers used where Wad so system matching would play factors here

 

[Jules_S]

Time for a...


Lots of love for these excellent amps on the Wam and plenty of satisfied owners - treat yourself and your system to some valve magic

 

[Jules_S]

Now that summer is over and the weather has calmed down to more temperate levels, time to treat yourself to a gorgeous new amp combo! So..... bumpetty-bumpetty-bump-bump-bump goes the ad

Remember, there's a new preamp fascia on its way to fix the only really visible cosmetic defect, and I am quite happy for anyone to have a demo of these at home (subject to distance, etc) even if you're not quite sure if they will work for you. If you don't try, you don't find out!

Also knocking a bit off the price so now looking for a nice round £3000. Might even consider a sensible offer... just saying

 

[hifinutt]

would it be worth giving price each ? not every one wants pre and power together

 

[Jules_S]

I don't want to split them up particularly, for a couple of reasons. Firstly they work so well as a pair, as you might imagine they are designed and voiced to get the best out of each other. Second, I run the risk of ending up selling one and not the other, which isn't a lot of use to me as I am now mainly looking at integrated amps to replace them with.

If someone is absolutely desperate for only one component I'll consider it as a last resort

 

[Rockchild]

I don't want to split them up particularly, for a couple of reasons. Firstly they work so well as a pair, as you might imagine they are designed and voiced to get the best out of each other. Second, I run the risk of ending up selling one and not the other, which isn't a lot of use to me as I am now mainly looking at integrated amps to replace them with.

If someone is absolutely desperate for only one component I'll consider it as a last resort

£1500 a piece is an absolute bargain. I had the pre below this and actually Jules, it was a fantastic pre on class A/B power amps and it was excellent running the power section of my Sugden a21a
I have never seen a Dialogue series for this sort of money. They would fly out the door on a certain selling site. Mine did and a lot more than I advertised here. GLWS

 

[Ian]

This is a heck of a deal. If my PL Prologue 5 is anything to go by, this pair must be bloody wonderful. I was late to the party as far as this brand was concerned, then a bit sniffy (not British !!), but so happy I got there in the end.

 

[Jules_S]

Thankyou gents. They really are a super combo, and like all PL amps, so flexible so you can tube-roll to your heart's content. If money were no object I'd probably keep them and assemble another system around them (with more sympathetic speakers!) - sadly that's not going to be possible.

When I saw these advertised they were up for £3750 - I paid a bit less than that after a haggle but I'm still losing a chunk of cash selling them on at the new price. My own stupid fault. And I've used them for no more than about 20 hours in the last couple of months of ownership.

Still trying to ascertain the approximate valve life - I'd assume they have "some" life left. Obviously 8 power valves will be a little bit of an expense when the time comes - I've been doing a bit of research and have come across this place that's actually not that far from me - they seem to have a pretty extensive selection of new, NOS and used valves. An identical replacement set of new Tung Sol KT120s is just over £300, KT88s a bit less, EL34s from the same price to... well, sky's the limit. Suffice to say there's a lot of choice and price difference but it doesn't have to break the bank (and you don't need a matched octet either!)

Billington Export

As far as I can tell the small signal valves will go on for a long time yet so would only need changing IF you fancied a different flavour.

Boxed up and ready to go! Jack (Non-Smoking Man) has kindly offered to "Wam-Taxi" them up the country if anyone is interested, and I can deliver around the south / south-western area.

 

[Non-Smoking Man]

These performed very well at Baggawire's recent bake off in Beckenham.
I tend to agree with Jules that they should remain together if at all possible.
They are boxed - which will make my life easier should I be required to transport them North from here in Chichester (Jules is Southampton).
I travel the weekend of the 6/7 August, possibly going up on the Friday.

Jack NSM.

 

[Jules_S]

Weekend bump. These are going on eBay soon if no further interest here.

Until 17th Sep they are available for demo in Loughborough so if you're in that sort of vicinity and wamt to have a listen then PM me for details. After the 17th they will be back down south for demo

 

[Non-Smoking Man]

I'm due to pick the Prima Lunas up from Loughborough during the Wam Taxi (weekend 17-18 September).

So they can be delivered to a prospective buyer en route.

See my forthcoming Wam Taxi thread in the Classifieds for details.

Jack NSM.

These deserve a good home.

 

[Jules_S]

Now sold