Wow or just my imagination

redken

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Can anyone help please. Have recently upgraded from Linn Basik with Mk1 Akito Armto Goldring GR2 with RB250 Arm and Goldring 1012GX Cartridge. I am very pleased with the extra detail, but there is one thing that is niggling me. I have noticed on a couple of tracks that have either slow held piano notes or slow acoustic strumming there seems to be a slight wavering in the tone. I have tested the speed with the audioorigami strobe disc and everyrthing seems ok at 50mhz. It could be that i am just noticing more detail although I have upgraded the standard platter to the Black Acrylic one from SRM Tech and this does weigh an extra 100 or so grammes. Do you think this could affect the belt performance? I have put the old platter back but it still seems to be there. I have read articles saying that an extent of wow occurs with all belt drive turntables and could it be that my ears are just too sensitive. I will no doubt get a definitive answer when I take the said vinyl round emmas house and listen on his superior equipment (he thinks I'm imagining it and should be sectioned) I would appreciate comments from anyone else who may have experienced this. By the way, I have checked the oil in the main bearing and all seems ok there.

 

griffo104

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I think this isa problem with most decks that don't have a heavy/massy platter or a seriously good psu. I noticed it on the P3 with large choral pieces of music, it almost seemed to slow down.

Piano is amongst the most difficult of instruments to reproduce for a belt drive. Decks the the Orbe get away with it due to the massy nature of the platter and the sophisticated psu. The problem may still be there with Emma's Orbe but it not be as easily detected. This is one of the reasons I preferred the Orbe of the LP12 - Classical music, especially piano and chral music, were much better served by the Orbe.

I think reproducing accurate paiano tones is one of the reasons Murrayhas a heavy plinthed direct drive Technics deck.

 
M

murray johnson

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That's true but it should still be possible to get adequate pitch stability from one of the rega based TT's. The fluctuations can come from grease/fingerprints on the drive belt/inner hub or indeed from some 'stiction' in the bearing. Make sure everything, motor pulley/drivebelt/inner platter are scrupulously clean, (warm water & a tiny drop of washing up liquid should suffice) and it may be worth investigating some of Audio Origami's slippery bearing oil although you'll need to clean out whatever lubricant is in the bearing as is before you put some of that in.

I think some people are more sensitive to this kind of slight wavering than others. It really bugs me but I've come across other systems/turntables where the owners aren't really concerned about it. I suppose it depends on the type of music listened to and certainly solo piano pieces with sustained decaying notes can highlight it.

 

redken

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Thanks for the advice Murray. I did clean the inner platter with white spirit. I have some SRM Tech "Black Oil" but how do I completely get the present oil out of the bearing housing? I thought of also purchasing an original Rega Belt (14 quid on eBay) as I dont know which belt is supplied with the GR2. Comforting to know that Griffo has experienced this and I'm not just imagining it.

 

rockmeister

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try a little talcum powder (if thats still available...your gran might have some on her sideboard) on the drive belt...just a smidge, wiped around and then most cleaned off with a tissue...it acts as a degreaser and adds slight grip to the belt, tuntable platter. If you have the oil just right, then I'm out of ideas after that...I have owned decks that had very slight wow no matter wot I did...not allengineering is perfect.
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ClassikFan

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I have experienced this sort of effect when playing LP's where the hole is slightly off centre. The closer the stylus gets to the middle the more pronounced the wow.

 
M

murray johnson

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I'd just remove the old oil as best you can with some rolled up soft toilet paper. Try not to leave any of the paper/fibres in the bearing housing. A new belt might help although if the deck is new you should talk to Goldring, explain the problem & try to get one from them. Don't mention your aftermarket mods though!

 

mrwippy

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ClassikFan wrote:

I have experienced this sort of effect when playing LP's where the hole is slightly off centre. The closer the stylus gets to the middle the more pronounced the wow.
Got there before me:)

I don't think any belt drive turntable, even those with hi-mass platters, are immune from an element of wow, every one I've listened to has exhibited this. Yes even my SME. I can't answer for direct drive turntables, I've never owned or even heard one. But it really depends how attuned you are to the problem as to how much this intrudes into the music. Unfortunately, once youareattuned to it, its very hard to ignore. There are alsoturntables that I feel have also been voiced to disguise the problem more than others.

The other factor is the LP itself (yes another negative element of vinyl)is it mainly noticeable on just a few LP's or all that you play and do you get it more toward the inner tracks? Look down at the headshell as the LP is playing to see if the LP is eccentric - don't go by the label most of those aren't in the centre.

 

redken

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thanks for your comments mrwhippy. I have only noticed this on a minority of tracks. 3 in fact, from different LP's and from varying track numbers. I have contacted goldring who are reluctant to deal directly with the public and have asked me to channel this through the suppliers I bought it off of (Superfi). They have been helpful and are trying to get me a new belt to try.

 

Emma Royd

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redken wrote:

(he thinks I'm imagining it and should be sectioned)
I've known this bloke for years,believe me, its been like an endurance test,he should have been sectioned years ago;)

 

mrwippy

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Emma Royd wrote:

redken wrote:
(he thinks I'm imagining it and should be sectioned)
I've known this bloke for years,believe me, its been like an endurance test,he should have been sectioned years ago;)
Fortunately, most Hi-Fi/Audio obsessive issues are probablynot recognised under the Mental Health Act. Although I suspect someone with a clinical interest in Mental Health issues could have a field-day with some of the threads.
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uzzy

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griffo104 wrote:

I think this isa problem with most decks that don't have a heavy/massy platter or a seriously good psu. I noticed it on the P3 with large choral pieces of music, it almost seemed to slow down.Piano is amongst the most difficult of instruments to reproduce for a belt drive. Decks the the Orbe get away with it due to the massy nature of the platter and the sophisticated psu. The problem may still be there with Emma's Orbe but it not be as easily detected. This is one of the reasons I preferred the Orbe of the LP12 - Classical music, especially piano and chral music, were much better served by the Orbe.

I think reproducing accurate paiano tones is one of the reasons Murrayhas a heavy plinthed direct drive Technics deck.
shock.gif.7732780fe7e208b945ce79ca96402fca.gif
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Anything with a massy turntable should have insufficient wow to induce this effect - that includes the Lin unless the bearing is tight or faulty

I would check the recording - as mentioned above off centre holes will cause it but I would suspect the recording to be at fault (unless of course you are getting it on every recording).

Check the turntable is spinning freely with no belt and see where it comes to a natural stop. Mark the turntable with a piece of selotape and spin it again - does it stop in the same place? If it does stop in virtually the same place or does not turn freely without the belt when given a small push it may indicate the bearing is tight or sticky.

Systemdek metal turntables where balanced (like a car wheel) to ensure that the mass was even across the turntable to ensure it span freely with no tendency to wobble or "kick" due to extra mass in one region (turn the platter upside down and you will see the drill outs).

Uzzy:nerd:

 

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