Sugden

[Rockchild]

Perhaps. But you'd need to suss it out spending some dedicated time in your listening environment with your particular set of speakers, etc. I'd guess that the S2 ("A21aMk2") would bear a closer resemblance to the A21a branch of the family compared with the SE's.

A21 is the original
A21a is from the 90’s
A21a S2 is from the 00’s
A21a Signature is 2017 onwards

A21SE introduced around 2008
A21SE Signature 2017 onwards

Sonically, you will prefer the A21a S2 or A21a Signature with your Harbeths. Despite power discussions, your brief will work well with this combination. I can assure you that the Sugden will give you texture, midrange and clarity that the Rega simply cannot match. I’ve read what your looking for and if in doubt, try and get a demo.

 

[Alvolake]

A21 is the original
A21a is from the 90’s
A21a S2 is from the 00’s
A21a Signature is 2017 onwards

A21SE introduced around 2008
A21SE Signature 2017 onwards

Sonically, you will prefer the A21a S2 or A21a Signature with your Harbeths. Despite power discussions, your brief will work well with this combination. I can assure you that the Sugden will give you texture, midrange and clarity that the Rega simply cannot match. I’ve read what your looking for and if in doubt, try and get a demo.

Only to point out that the A21 was designed by James Sugden, the A21a in its various external guises (different colour script and on/off buttons but same cases - horizontal heat sinks) were designed by the Millers as was the A21Se which came out at double the price of the A21a due to a completely different case (vertical heatsinks and remote) and a revamp of the pre (cascode) and the power supply (beefier - bigger tranny) before the A21aS2 came out a couple of years later , with a new case and bigger power supply perhaps in an attempt to bridge the price gap between A21a and the SE which was considerable. Then the Signature surname was added to all their amps in 2017 to distinguish them from all the earlier models. In any case, an EE mate says they all share the same basic circuit , hence the A21 family name.

 

[stevehecht]

Rockchild: I very much appreciate your extensive knowledge and experience concerning these amps. I'm going to lurk around the used component sites for a bit, and if the pickings are sparse I will spring for $2650 for a new A21al Signature from a US dealer.

 

[Rockchild]

Rockchild: I very much appreciate your extensive knowledge and experience concerning these amps. I'm going to lurk around the used component sites for a bit, and if the pickings are sparse I will spring for $2650 for a new A21al Signature from a US dealer.

Good Luck Steve, as long as your not looking at head banging levels, it will be a combination that is very difficult to achieve elsewhere.

 

[Bigwig07]

Rockchild: I very much appreciate your extensive knowledge and experience concerning these amps. I'm going to lurk around the used component sites for a bit, and if the pickings are sparse I will spring for $2650 for a new A21al Signature from a US dealer.

Rockchild is the Sugden guru

I believe Colonel Mad over on PFM has a 1 year old A21a Sig for sale (ex Rockchild amp?) with phono stage

If you buy from abroad check for import duties

 

[Tomo]

The 21se is in place and sounding bloody lovely. Even the wife has noticed a change in sound. Going to be a while before I make a proper assessment in comparison to my roksan and naim amps but yeh, it’s a keeper.

 

[Rockchild]

The 21se is in place and sounding bloody lovely. Even the wife has noticed a change in sound. Going to be a while before I make a proper assessment in comparison to my roksan and naim amps but yeh, it’s a keeper.

Good stuff. Just remember those fins get hot so make sure there is room for it and allow at least 20 mins once turned on for best results. What cables are you using?

 

[Tomo]

Good stuff. Just remember those fins get hot so make sure there is room for it and allow at least 20 mins once turned on for best results. What cables are you using?

I’ve got about 6cm either side and loads of space on top but will probably get a new proper hifi stand at some point.
Speaker cables are Atlas hyper 2, interconnects are chord clearway on the phono stage & turntable and then I’ve got a qed one on node 2i.

 

[Alvolake]

I’ve got about 6cm either side and loads of space on top but will probably get a new proper hifi stand at some point.
Speaker cables are Atlas hyper 2, interconnects are chord clearway on the phone stage & turntable and then I’ve got a qed one on node 2i.

If you have lots of space on top, you could try taller feet which would allow more air to get better "sucked up and out through the top". Either some sort of base extension under the suggie feet or, as I did, some Sound spike Wills maglev feet which leave the sugden ones dangling in free air. I swear I noticed a difference when I placed them under the toroidal in a sort of triangle but not earth-moving more an "icing on the cake" type of difference, plus I was given them as a present ´cos they ain´t cheap but I really believe they lower the "noise floor".

 

[stevehecht]

Rockchild is the Sugden guru

I believe Colonel Mad over on PFM has a 1 year old A21a Sig for sale (ex Rockchild amp?) with phono stage

If you buy from abroad check for import duties

What is PFM?

 

[Bigwig07]

What is PFM?

Pinkfishmedia - a hi fi forum a bit like HiFiWigwam

https://pinkfishmedia.net/forum/

 

[Tomo]

So I’ve have about 10 hours listening to the sugden. Initial impressions were, ‘yeh this better than the roksan’ but listening now, it’s clearly a lot better. Which is expected.

The a21se is more tonally even. The roksan was a bit bass heavy and flat at times. I’m now hearing things that weren’t so clear before. And the soundstage has opened up.

I was a bit nervous as I auditioned the sugden ages ago and with different proacs to what I have (not ideal). But the A21se and proac d2’s appear to be a great match.

I also got an external phonostage to go with the Sugden (I was using the internal one on the roksan previously). This probably also contributed to the improvements I’m hearing.

 

[stevehecht]

Just checking in here to complement Tomo's reporting. My Sugden A21 Signature (graphite face plate) is clearly an improvement over the Rega Brio R (now up for sale on Head-Fi for $650 inclusive). Without full burn-in the articulation (imaging) and warmth/musicality are very impressive and enjoyable. I'm running the A21 with Harbeth P3ESRs and it's a good match. Even with the P3s ~30cm from the rear wall in a small room the bass is clear and not muddy or boomy. Playing a c.1990 Tallis Scholars recording ( (in-)famous for producing somnetimes excruciating bias toward the higher frequencies) the A21/P3 combo kept things comfortable and civilized. And of course the mids are rich and joyful. For baroque music, which is what I mostly listen to, this is a marriage made in heaven.

 

[Amormusic]

Silver minty A21a Signature line only soon up for grabs I think...

I never thought I'd move it on, as I completely love it, but I've been seduced by valves and I cannot justify it being sat in its box, unused.

I might be possibly even be up for some form of an exchange with cash my way for an older version A21a if someone's fancying an upgrade to the current Signature model. Hence my post here and not in the FS section.

I've not fully committed to my thought process, but keep your eyes peeled for the classifieds section, should it tickle your fancy...

No responses needed as I don't want to incur the wrath of mods for interest checking etc. (tbh, this should move pretty quickly anyway, I already know that - I just need to decide properly I'm ready to let it go ).

 

[hifinutt]

 

[Idlewithnodrive]

Does anyone know how long it is taking to get a returns number from Sugden at the moment?

I have now been waiting 10 weeks

Can anybody suggest a route other than going through their website?

Thanks in advance.

 

[Idlewithnodrive]

Does anyone know how long it is taking to get a returns number from Sugden at the moment?

I have now been waiting 10 weeks

Can anybody suggest a route other than going through their website?

Thanks in advance.

Now number 4 in the queue, so hopeful it will be looked at this year

 

[Idlewithnodrive]

Yay, finally received my Returns / Repair slot. My amp will be winging it's way to Sugden by the weekend

 

[Rockchild]

Yay, finally received my Returns / Repair slot. My amp will be winging it's way to Sugden by the weekend

That’s taken a while Mike!

 

[Idlewithnodrive]

Virtually 5 months John. Still, it'll all be worth it when it's returned !