Speaker recommendations for Quad system

[Orko79]

Hi all

While I’ve enjoyed reading the WAM on and off for a few years this is my first post and hoping I can tap into some of the expertise on here. 

I’m in the process of getting my first proper hi-fi system having previously had to integrate into my AV set-up.  The equipment I have so far is;

Quad 909 power amp, Quad Qc 24 valve pre amp (with phono stage), Quad CDP-2 and Michell Gyrodec TT. 

However, I’m getting stuck when looking at speakers. I’m limited to standmounters which will be placed in my lounge measuring approx 7.1m x 5.7m (altho it is open-plan to a dining area and then kitchen meaning a large open space). Positioning is likely to be close to the rear wall behind the main seating position. My budget is up to £700 and was looking mainly s/h. 

Options I’d considered were B&W CM5 S2, Kef R300, Spendor S3/5R2 and then the new(ish) Quad S2s. I am sorely tempted by the latter given the great reviews they’ve received together with the fact the rest of the system is Quad based.  My concern however is that they might just get lost in the room and lack impact, which may be a risk in all of these. To mitigate this I do have a REL Quake SW that I could also deploy in this set-up (altho it would need to be shared by the AV system in my lounge).

One final point it would be good to get guidance on is streaming. I have all my music ripped to Apple Lossless and stored on a Mac mini and I’d like to be able to stream my library to this system in a cheap and efficient way. I do have the option of a Sonos connect but I’m not sure if that is overkill. 

I’ve been at this for a couple of months now so any and all thoughts / recommendations would be more than welcome so I can finally get on with listening to some music!

Thanks

 

[graham67]

Hi Orko, 

Welcome to the wam!. 

What sort of music do you favour?  Also can you do larger standmounts?  IME a larger standmount can blend the best of both worlds.  If you are restricted to a small box for aesthetic reasons, it may struggle to move enough air in a big space.

I have owned the line version of the QC24 (as well as older quad 405 power amps) so i imagine your pre power combo should have a fairly warm tonal balance? Which could mean you could try a more studio monitor type sound unless your room is particularly bright or reflective.

What speakers have you used so far and what did you think of the sound in the room?

Also, what part of the country are you in?  it may be an idea to get along to a bake off or a friendly wammers place  and listen to some different speakers.

graham

 

[bencat]

Hello Orko

Welcome to the world of posting on the Wam be careful it can become very additictive . If you are looking to have the speakers hard against a wall then I would recommend that you have a look at speakers that are designed for that placement. In general Inifite / Sealed Baffle speakers (KEF 103 Reference (1970,s model) or perhaps the Isobarik Linns Sara 9,s .

I have and use both and they work very well in the back against the wall position which gives the bass a little extra kick . One draw back with this type of placement is that you do lose out a little in the imaging as it tends to be a straight line in front of the speakers rather than out of box room acoustic .

I am sure there are many other sealed baffle units ATC spring to mind as having some of their smaller monitors sealed units and they are always given pretty good reviews . Problem is I have not heard that many others and it would be in my view wrong to give you a recommendation of something I have not used myself.

 

[savvypaul]

Semi-omnis can fill  a room very well with even an 8" driver. The sound is consistent around the room, too, so you don't have to be sat in 'the hotspot'. They are also placed near a wall. Well worth hearing. Try examples from Larsen, NVA and Shahinian. No need for a sub...

 

[tuga]

I agree with @graham67, your room is too big for mini-standmounts.

As for those speakers that you have listed, I'd give up on the Spendors because the have very limited bass extension and will not play loud enough in such a large room. I find that BnWs have serious shortcomings, so I'd give those a pass too, but that doesn't mean that you shouldn't audition them. I'd rule out speakers with small woofers (Ø < 6.5") and use the sub (or two).

For streaming you can use an Apple Airport Express or a Google Chromecast and there are other more expensive alternatives. Which music player software do you use? Do you plan to control it with your phone?

 

[uzzy]

Hi all

While I’ve enjoyed reading the WAM on and off for a few years this is my first post and hoping I can tap into some of the expertise on here. 

I’m in the process of getting my first proper hi-fi system having previously had to integrate into my AV set-up.  The equipment I have so far is;

Quad 909 power amp, Quad Qc 24 valve pre amp (with phono stage), Quad CDP-2 and Michell Gyrodec TT. 

However, I’m getting stuck when looking at speakers. I’m limited to standmounters which will be placed in my lounge measuring approx 7.1m x 5.7m (altho it is open-plan to a dining area and then kitchen meaning a large open space). Positioning is likely to be close to the rear wall behind the main seating position. My budget is up to £700 and was looking mainly s/h. 

Options I’d considered were B&W CM5 S2, Kef R300, Spendor S3/5R2 and then the new(ish) Quad S2s. I am sorely tempted by the latter given the great reviews they’ve received together with the fact the rest of the system is Quad based.  My concern however is that they might just get lost in the room and lack impact, which may be a risk in all of these. To mitigate this I do have a REL Quake SW that I could also deploy in this set-up (altho it would need to be shared by the AV system in my lounge).

One final point it would be good to get guidance on is streaming. I have all my music ripped to Apple Lossless and stored on a Mac mini and I’d like to be able to stream my library to this system in a cheap and efficient way. I do have the option of a Sonos connect but I’m not sure if that is overkill. 

I’ve been at this for a couple of months now so any and all thoughts / recommendations would be more than welcome so I can finally get on with listening to some music!

Thanks

I can't understand, except in very specific circumstances, why anyone would restrict themselves to stand mounters, when the overall footprint of stands plus speakers is not a lot different (and sometimes greater) than many modern floor standards (and a few old ones).  Your lounge is big and small standmounts will not fill the room (so you need to sit close or listen at low volumes) and the temptation will be to turn it up and they will not go up .. 

If you must have standmounters then I would look to the past and specifically the IMF super compacts.  They are a three way in a small transmission line (and they are small loudspeakers) and will do a good job.  If you can find a pair the Radford Tristars are also a three way bookshelf and have the same driver arrangement of the bigger transmission line T90s .. they are a magical loudspeaker from the past and when and if you hear them you will understand what I mean.  They to will not be swamped by the space in your lounge.   Both of the above are front ported so positioning close to a wall is feasible.

It is hard to determine how small a footprint you want to achieve but of modern designs PMC do transmission line floorstander with a small footprint .. but if you can fit them in your lounge I would seek out a pair of Cambridge R40 or even better R50 floor standing transmission lines.  They are about 10" wide but about 20" deep .. so very narrow.  The main drive array of both is the Kef B139, B110, and T27 tweeter and the R50 has a coles supertweeter and stands about 8 inches taller (having said that the R40s like being lifted up about 6 inches (many make a wooden plinth).  The big advantage of these loudspeakers is the drive units have rubber surrounds on the cones (no foam rot) which is why I did not suggest the KEF 104 2 (which is a superb speaker but the internal bass unit has a foam doughnut which does rot and need replacing .. also with age the tweeter can seize up and the ferrofluid in it needs cleaning out and replacing).

Of the more modern designs as I have said PMC do some full range transmission lines with a very small footprint - but also worth considering are Totem (small footprint big sound), and a host of others such as Proac and Dynaudio and Spendor.  Also if you can find a pair there are the Art Modern and Deco of which the smallest in each range has a very small footprint 

In my opinion all of the above will knock spots off the suggestions you have made .. my brother was going to buy some B&W 684s until he heard a pair of Cambridge R40s .. he just could not believe how cohesive the overall sound and how much better the bass was with the 40 year old R40s compared to the B&W.  So he bought the R40s for £120 and smiled deeply at the sound and the money he saved.

The world is your oyster - but please make sure it has to be stand mounts and go get your ears around as many loudspeakers as you can .. reviews are just a guide and your ears may tell you something completely different. 

If you go second hand the options open are far greater and will provide much greater value .. 

My wife wanted small unobtrusive loudspeakers until she heard the Art Impressions and we ended up buying them - my lounge is a tad narrower than yours so they would sound even better in your room

 

[Frizbriz]

I think the above comments are accurate about small floor standers, I was going to suggest the pro ac hexas , either the small monitors or the dinky towers, I had the standmounts with the 909 and they worked really well together. Pmc also make some largish standmounts that fill large spaces with ease, and there's usually plenty around.

I use a airport express on my notebook, works fine as a convenient second source.

 

[tuga]

these

What are those?

 

[greybeard]

What are those?

Art Impressions, an a tad over £700!!

 

[dudywoxer]

Have a. Word with kralk,

http://kralkaudio.com/shop/kralk-audio-tdb-10-professional-3-way-monitor

Tsb 8 or 10 may fit your requirement, new, just around budget

 

[graham67]

Have a. Word with kralk,

http://kralkaudio.com/shop/kralk-audio-tdb-10-professional-3-way-monitor

Tsb 8 or 10 may fit your requirement, new, just around budget

Nice one dudy!  I had these in mind too, having heard similar sized 10" JBL monitors (on which these Kralk appear to be are unashamedly based) fill a huge open plan room without trouble. 

However as much as I love the retro look, they may not be to everyone's taste, hence my question about big standmounters and aesthetics!!!!

 

[tuga]

Art Impressions, an a tad over £700!!

I'm visiting their website, the new model looks very interesting and quite good looking too:

https://www.loudspeaker-art.com/art-loudspeakers-dram-12

How much does that cost? With those fancy SEAS drivers it can't be less than £7000.

Pity about the ported cabinet but otherwise very much on target.

I wonder if they'll have a room at the Leamington Spa show...

 

[tuga]

Zoinks!!! :shock:

£22,500.00 for the "cheaper" AlNiCo model.

.

Schiit, they costs as much as a pair of B&W 800 D3s!!!

These guys are not kidding.

 

[greybeard]

I wonder if they'll have a room at the Leamington Spa show...

I cannot see any mention of them being there.

Oh and they are from £22,500!!!

 

[tuga]

What types of music do you listen too?

Speakers suitable for classical music at low volume are probably not going to be ideal for heavy metal at very high volume, and vice versa.

I agree somewhat. It's not about the musical genre but the tonal balance. Speakers that sound balanced at lower or reasonable levels will sound a bit bass heavy whilst speakers designed to play loud will often sound thin and bass shy at lower volumes.

We've all heard that at shows, speakers that don't sound balanced unless the volume is cranked up to deafening levels. Bin them. 

 

[uzzy]

Art Impressions, an a tad over £700!!

Aye - hence not recommended for his budget - but all the others are well within (except PMC and Spendor unless second hand) .. don't blame me the missus made me buy them

 

[uzzy]

I agree somewhat. It's not about the musical genre but the tonal balance. Speakers that sound balanced at lower or reasonable levels will sound a bit bass heavy whilst speakers designed to play loud will often sound thin and bass shy at lower volumes.

We've all heard that at shows, speakers that don't sound balanced unless the volume is cranked up to deafening levels. Bin them. 

A well designed loudspeaker will be as revealing at low volumes as it is at high volumes.  We have all heard (I hope) heard many speakers that sound great at any volume  (DCM Timewindows, Cambridge R40s and 50s, IMFs, Radfords, Quad ELS 63s and the newer ones, Tannoy 15inch monitor golds, etc. etc. etc). .... even my old Gale 401s sounded great at all levels as do the good old Yamaha NS1000s.

My Art Impressions never cease to amaze me at the bass detail at low level listening .. and the same at moderate and high levels (the difference being the smack in the chest and stomach and actually feeling the bass at higher volume levels)  .. so when you go and get your ears around a loudspeaker ideally it should be in your own home and listened to at all levels to ensure they deliver what you want.  I will not comment about speaker designers and their aims (do some people only design a hifi loudspeaker to sound good at high volume levels or low volume levels?  If they do then they have a product on their hands that will only appeal to a limited number of people and I would think would all fall at review level if the reviewer is honest.

I do agree it is a fact that at low levels bass human hearing is such that bass frequencies may seem slightly diminished and so it can sound unbalanced with the upper mid and treble taking over as it is "louder" .. I guess the thing about a great design is it manages to diminish this effect  although at low levels you may hear but will never feel the bass physically (as you do in live performance and when a great speaker is played are realistic levels.  I never feel the need to reach for the bass to be turned up nor did I feel the need with my  first speakers (Marantz 4g) or my old Gales or Pro9TLs or the Time WIndows I recently acquired for my lad.  Similarly the same was true of the Systemdek Systym 931s in the conservatory (now residing in my daughters bedroom) which are LS35A sized.   

So go get listening and enjoy the journey to find the speakers within your budget where buying second hand will let you reach out for nirvana at a price you can afford.

 

[tuga]

A well designed loudspeaker will be as revealing at low volumes as it is at high volumes.

I agree with this.

I was only referring to tonal balance. Some speakers need the help of a loudness circuit to sound good at low volume levels. It has to do with the frequency sensitivity of humans at diferent SPLs ( https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Equal-loudness_contour )

 

[Orko79]

I just got back in the country in the small hours so this is my first chance to respond.

Firstly, thanks for the quick, considered and insightful input.  This has given me food for thought and may send me off in a totally different direction.  To briefly answer a couple of queries that have been raised

• The music i'll be playing will be quite varied; rock, neo-classical, metal, indie, post-rock, jazz, pop, electronica, ambient, experimental, drone etc.  This is part of my problem as i'm not sure there is a one-size fits all.  However, there won't be any R&B, hip hop or dance music so the lack of booming bass should not be a major issue.
  
• I've only heard this specific set up with Dali Suite 2.8s and then a similar one with Spendor A5 and A6 (the latter was sublime).  So, I only have floor standers as a reference. It isn't installed in my lounge as yet but hoping to rectify that this weekend.
  
• The room doesn't sound bright when using my AV system, although it does have wooden floors and a 'modern' low-ish ceiling height.  Sofas, thick curtains and rugs seem to be providing the necessary dampening
  

I'll do some digging around the larger stand mounters that have been mentioned as it will be an incredibly hard sell to get floor standers.  I'll also take a trek into the hi-fi stores in Glasgow tomorrow to see what goodies are on show.