Second hand alternatives to a Harbeth P3ESR?

[Hyperknot]

Here is my very simple question, what are the recommended second hand alternatives to a Harbeth P3ESR?

Longer version: I've spend a 4 hour demo listening to a Harbeth P3ESR and I've absolutely fallen in love with the sound. Yes, bass is lacking and it has a laughable size, but for jazz / vocal / acoustic music there was something in that speaker which I very rarely hear, even at shows. We've been playing around with the placement of the speaker and at one point it felt like it totally disappeared, it was quite magical.

Now, having said that I am not willing to spend up to 3k EUR on a shoebox, especially knowing that it needs a good DAC and a good amp. (We tried it with 150 EUR USB DAC and a 15k EUR TAD DAC and the difference was night and day, there goes the belief that all modern DACs sound the same).

Given my country is not the UK and this LS3/5a line is almost missing here, I'd like to ask you what kind of alternatives could you recommend from the second hand market.

The other question is how well the second hand units keep their performance? Do they have capacitors which need to be replaced and are they prone to foam rot / need refoaming?

Here are some of the options I've been considering:
- Spendor S3/5 460 GBP (local buy)
- Harbeth M20 (P3-ES2 like with Speakon), 530 GBP (local buy)
- Spendor S3/5R2 560 GBP (from the UK)
- Spendor S3/5R 500 GBP (from the UK)
- brand new LS3/5a from Stirling with Monacor + ScanSpeak for about 800 GBP

I guess even the oldest R2 is recent enough that age should not be a problem, but what about the S3/5 or the Harbeth M20? Those are up to 20 years old, would they still be recommended buys?

 

[Jazid]

What Is your country then? Climate may enter into consideration here, and choice of rubber vs foam vs paper surrounds, and longevity of components if you're somewhere warm and humid.

PS. I haven't heard them but have only ever heard good things about Stirling's products.

Sent from my BLA-L09 using Tapatalk

 

[jas0_0]

What about the Proac Tablette 10?  Like the P3ESR, it’s evolved from the BBC LS3/5a.  Similar dimensions to the P3ESR, sealed box and very well regarded.  Can be had second hand for about £600-£700.

Though if you loved the Harbeth, I fear you’ll only ever be satisfied with the Harbeth! 

 

[Nopiano]

Though if you loved the Harbeth, I fear you’ll only ever be satisfied with the Harbeth! 

I was just about to say the same.  These tiny ‘monitors’ are an acquired taste, and one that I’ve rarely ‘got’.  

I would instead get some lovely KEF LS50s, as I did back at Easter. They’re £800 new or around £550 used.  They are like LS3/5as would have been if they had had the technology forty years ago, but others will disagree!  Worth hearing before you gamble on some Harbeth lookalikes!

 

[bencat]

All I can say is that in my experience and the views of the Harbeth Designer they are one of the few speaker lines were all of the speakers have a very similar sound just slightly increased bass performance as you get bigger cabinets . So my Harbeth Compact monitors sound very similar to the smaller P3 ESR but are just that bit bigger and have more bass.

I tried to sell my pair about six months ago for around £850 but got no interest so you could perhaps pick up somehting a bit higher up the Harbeth chain.

 

[Hyperknot]

My country is Hungary. Luckily climate is very moderate here, not too humid or too dry. How are the drivers / foams in these line of speakers, how much do I need to worry?

Is it safe to say that if they sound nice in a demo (for local market ones) I can safely buy them? I still have a pair of B&O S45.2 (rubber foam) and one of them sound really bad. Might be the capacitors, might be something else, but if Spendors or Proac is anything like B&O then it's quite risky to buy second hand isn't it?

 

[jas0_0]

My country is Hungary. Luckily climate is very moderate here, not too humid or too dry. How are the drivers / foams in these line of speakers, how much do I need to worry?

Is it safe to say that if they sound nice in a demo (for local market ones) I can safely buy them? I still have a pair of B&O S45.2 (rubber foam) and one of them sound really bad. Might be the capacitors, might be something else, but if Spendors or Proac is anything like B&O then it's quite risky to buy second hand isn't it?

I would say the risk is quite low with speakers built this century.  I have only ever bought second hand.  I bought my current Proacs two years ago.  They were made in 1999 and they’re still going strong.    

 

[uzzy]

I would leave the LS35A off the list if you listen to rock and like your music at more realistic volumes

I would add Dynaudio https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Dynaudio-Emit-M10-Loudspeakers-Satin-Black/293087307226?epid=1163931958&hash=item443d5d65da:g:TJkAAOSwm2ddQLm0

Would also have a look at these 

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/PCM-DB1-Advanced-Transmission-Line-Speakers-used-with-Naim/283628638936?hash=item42099592d8:g:dl8AAOSwyQ1dkRzc

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Harberh-HL-P3-BBC-Monitor-LS3-5a-Vintage-Studio-Monitor/163880887148?hash=item26280fe36c:g:MGwAAOSwOZ5djTAH

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Pairof-Harbeth-Acoustic-Broadcast-Monitors-HL-P3-Britsh-made-Tested/274024848450?hash=item3fcd275c42:g:gR0AAOSw9OZdi3yE

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Jamo-Concert-8-D830-Speakers-With-Stands/183973766668?hash=item2ad5b0e60c:g:09oAAOSw5Y1dhHkV

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/PROAC-TABLETTE-ANNIVERSARY-SPEAKERS-BOXED/193122355044?hash=item2cf6fd4764:g:WYQAAOSwZwldiyvb

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Totem-Mites-Walnut-speaker-pair-with-or-without-80-matching-Totem-stands/202640137077?hash=item2f2e4b1b75:g:MkYAAOSwxplcn5jM  massive sound for a small pair of loudspeakers

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/JIM-ROGERS-JR150-Vintage-Speakers-original-mint-condition-rare-audiophile-bbc/264482021597?hash=item3d945b60dd:gS0AAOSwi~BdaQ2g (like LS35A but with two bass mid units)

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Neat-Motive-3-Speakers-Oak/264482038716?hash=item3d945ba3bc:g:ZIAAAOSwPE5djKiQ

Or you could buy these (Celef - same designers as Proac from way back when - bargain at this price) https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Vintage-Celef-Mini-Professional-HE/123916384760?hash=item1cd9fdf9f8:g:hwkAAOSwRPBdSJwX  or these https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Celef-HiFi-Speakers-Vintage-Gold/323931261672?hash=item4b6bcecae8:g:vPMAAOSwcwxddV~k  but they may be a bit too big for you?

Good luck in your quest 

 

[hifinutt]

you can buy very good condition p3esr for around 1000 -1100 pounds s/h , is that worth looking at ?

 

[chebby]

iFi Audio Retro ls3.5

https://ifi-audio.com/products/retro-ls3-5/

(£790 per pair in the UK).

 

[Nagraboy]

I had some Spendor S3/5R for a few months before my most recent Harbeth P3ESR and although a very good little speaker for the money, they weren’t quite up to the Harbeth standard.

I’ve had P3ESR since 2011 - apart from about a year or so dabbling with B&O/Tannoy/Spendor. Can’t see me changing them.

 

[Hyperknot]

How are the older Harbeth P3s (pre-RADIAL ones)? The original P3s are quite old now, but the ES2 was introduced in around 2005, so it should be ok. AFAIK the Monitor 20 I could buy is the same as the ES2 with Speakon connector (and ugly grey finish).

Hifinutt, if I can find a really good condition P3ESR for around 1000, I think I'd probably be open for it. If anyone knows of one please PM me.

Nopiano, I might be able to demo an LS50 locally, but from what I've read most people consider its sound too bright, brighter than the Harbeth, which I wouldn't want. I'm looking for something musical which isn't fatiguing. (Same reason for not looking at Dynaudio).

Uzzy, from your list, which ones do you consider to be recommended for a blind purchase? I mean for example those Celefs look more like 40+ years old. I've read reports from Stirling Broadcast that most of the speakers which people send for check / repairs are vastly out of specs.

 

[hifinutt]

Just keep your eyes open , I sold mine which had slight damage recently for 925 pounds in cherry. Dealers in uk can also do very good deals on rrp particularly Ian Harrison in derby. Who advertises in hi fi news. You may be surprised at what you get. 

 

[Hyperknot]

It's not the simplest thing to find an ad in a printed British magazine from here, but I tried, is this his number: 01283 702875?

 

[wizmax]

It's not the simplest thing to find an ad in a printed British magazine from here, but I tried, is this his number: 01283 702875?

According to this months Hi Fi Choice that is the correct telephone number.

 

[hifinutt]

yes thats it 

 

[forgot-my-id]

According to this months Hi Fi Choice that is the correct telephone number.

0044 1283 702875 from forin places

 

[Tarzan]

If you have fallen for the Harbeth sound- then accept no substitute- it will end costing you pain and more money.

 

[hifinutt]

Hyperknot ,Just noticed a guy in hungary on the harbeth facebook page got his p3esr delivered . if you are not on there you might like to link up sometime